Author Topic: Proving Grounds Heavy- why not?  (Read 1361 times)

superaielman

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Proving Grounds Heavy- why not?
« on: April 07, 2021, 11:25:00 AM »
Fuse (Saga)- He finally got his own story in the Saga remaster out this month! Let's see how he does in PG.
Rudo Marco (Brig)- Hits like a truck and takes a lot of punishment.
Kir (I am Setsuna)- Vanish is a neat enough trick.
Vanille (FF13)- fights differently than the rest of field, want to see how she does in comparison.

Fuse vs Claude (SO2)
Fuse vs Wugui (SH1)
Fuse vs Odd Eye (SF2)
Fuse vs Sierra (S2)
Fuse vs Daos (Lufias)
Fuse vs Ryu (BoF1)
Fuse vs Sync (TotA)
Fuse vs Hect (G3)
Fuse vs Zapdos (PKMN)
Fuse vs Hiro (Lunar:EBC)
Fuse vs Geddoe (S3)
Fuse vs Rosa (FF4)

Rudo vs Claude (SO2)
Rudo vs Wugui (SH1)
Rudo vs Odd Eye (SF2)
Rudo vs Sierra (S2)
Rudo vs Daos (Lufias)
Rudo vs Ryu (BoF1)
Rudo vs Sync (TotA)
Rudo vs Hect (G3)
Rudo vs Zapdos (PKMN)
Rudo vs Hiro (Lunar:EBC)
Rudo vs Geddoe (S3)
Rudo vs Rosa (FF4)

Kir vs Claude (SO2)
Kir vs Wugui (SH1)
Kir vs Odd Eye (SF2)
Kir vs Sierra (S2)
Kir vs Daos (Lufias)
Kir vs Ryu (BoF1)
Kir vs Sync (TotA)
Kir vs Hect (G3)
Kir vs Zapdos (PKMN)
Kir vs Hiro (Lunar:EBC)
Kir vs Geddoe (S3)
Kir vs Rosa (FF4)

Vanille vs Claude (SO2)
Vanille vs Wugui (SH1)
Vanille vs Odd Eye (SF2)
Vanille vs Sierra (S2)
Vanille vs Daos (Lufias)
Vanille vs Ryu (BoF1)
Vanille vs Sync (TotA)
Vanille vs Hect (G3)
Vanille vs Zapdos (PKMN)
Vanille vs Hiro (Lunar:EBC)
Vanille vs Geddoe (S3)
Vanille vs Rosa (FF4)
"Reputation is what other people know about you. Honor is what you know about yourself"- Count Aral Vorkosigan, A Civil Campaign
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<Meeple> knownig Square-enix, they'll just give us a 2nd Kain
<Ciato> he would be so kawaii as a chibi...

superaielman

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Re: Proving Grounds Heavy- why not?
« Reply #1 on: April 07, 2021, 11:41:42 AM »
Fuse vs Claude (SO2)- Too much damage.
Fuse vs Wugui (SH1)- Block ID, buff up and outlast. Wugui's not hopeless when his tricks are blocked, but he loses more often than not in Heavy when they are.
Fuse vs Odd Eye (SF2)- Evasion gives Odd Eye a little trouble, but offhand the damage is coming too quickly for Fuse to deal with even post Awakening.
Fuse vs Sierra (S2)- Kneejerk of Fuse having more healing.
Fuse vs Daos (Lufias)- Daos might be able to get lucky with Terror Wave, but meh to respecting that against anything but Vanille like stall strats.
Fuse vs Ryu (BoF1)- Should heal lock even post Awakening.
Fuse vs Sync (TotA)- Fuse isn't avoiding one of Sync's limits. Even with Awakening up, he isn't tanking Akashic Torment or Harrowing Gale.
Fuse vs Hect (G3)- Tenative. If Fuse can avoid a OHKO, he can alternate turns with healing and doing damage. Anything he does to Hect sticks due to no healing, and he's much faster after buffing. Definitely willing to listen to arguments on this one though, as Fuse has resource issues in long fights.
Fuse vs Zapdos (PKMN)- Paralyze+Pressure is a real bad combo for Fuse.... oh and he halves Fighting damage. Bye Fuse!
Fuse vs Hiro (Lunar:EBC)-Runs Hiro out of MP. Hiro has nothing to really heal lock with besides Triple Sword and that burns through his resources too quickly.
Fuse vs Geddoe (S3)- Hammer of Raijin to the face solves a lot of problems. I wasn't expecting Geddoe of all people to be the one to stomp this field, but he is dangerous if you don't resist thunder or can't quickly status him out.
Fuse vs Rosa (FF4)-Fuse isn't a blitzer.

Rudo vs Claude (SO2)- Ripper blast won't trigger counters and Claude has Holy defense to slow down Rudo's offense, but he's under a lot of pressure. I think he's opting for Ripper Blast/Energy Sword for this fight and try to outlast; blitzing is not going to happen. I'm tenatively voting this way right now, but open to arguments.
Rudo vs Wugui (SH1)- Wugui should survive a Clean Military Rule and I don't think it matters even slightly.
Rudo vs Odd Eye (SF2)- Odd Eye does not like those counter attacks. Odd Eye Beam is not cutting it here and he doesn't have long considering how much damage Clean Military Rule is doing. Rudo blocking sleep just removes any doubt.
Rudo vs Sierra (S2)- OHKO. This is pretty close but Sierra's meh defense sinks her here.
Rudo vs Daos (Lufias)- Daos vs nuclear grade holy physicals? We've seen how this goes in game. Spoiler: Not well. Rudo OHKOs Daos 3, Daos 2 might not get OHKOed but it so doesn't matter. I think Daos's best form here is Lufia 1.

When Daos is using his scrub ass 3HKO to average Lufia 1 form, you know the fight is a lost cause.

Rudo vs Ryu (BoF1)- Unsure. Ryu's a hell of a physical tank and ignores the counters, which makes me lean towards him. E: Detransforming didn't heal him, right. yeah that's probably enough.
Rudo vs Sync (TotA)- The good news is Sync resists light damage! That... actually helps a lot. But too much of his offense is gated by HP limits, which is really bad against Rudo. He's running into the counters as well. Thinking that Rudo can just smash past Harrowing Gale and tank the rest.

Rudo vs Hect (G3)- OHKO.
Rudo vs Zapdos (PKMN)- 2HKOs and I don't think Zapdos can do anything to stop this.
Rudo vs Hiro (Lunar:EBC)- *checks*... he tanks two Triple Swords? Okay that I did not expect.
Rudo vs Geddoe (S3)- Hammer of Raijin/Soaring Bolt combo works well enough. Rudo's not taking *that* much magic damage.
Rudo vs Rosa (FF4)- OHKO.

Vanille vs Claude (SO2)- Vanille is horribly heal locked by Claude's basic physical.
Vanille vs Wugui (SH1)- Game of Death.
Vanille vs Odd Eye (SF2)- Hits too hard, too quickly.
Vanille vs Sierra (S2)- ID.
Vanille vs Daos (Lufias)- Terror Wave is a pretty low percentage proc, but two of the three statuses are bad news for Vanille. Daos's magic durability and elemental resist means she's doing almost no damage with Ravager; she's hoping to outlast till a limit. As bad as Terror Wave is, it's going to easily outrace that. -_-
Vanille vs Ryu (BoF1)- Agree with Snowfire on this one.
Vanille vs Sync (TotA)- Vanille is *dead dead dead* if Sync gets a single turn below 75% HP. That said, I don't see why she just doesn't do medic spam until limit. Sync's damage isn't good at full HP.
Vanille vs Hect (G3)- OHKO. Hect offense is scary if you don't wall it or smash her before she gets a turn.
Vanille vs Zapdos (PKMN)- Pressure does bad things to Vanille here.
Vanille vs Hiro (Lunar:EBC)-Kneejerk Hiro going first here, which is enough.
Vanille vs Geddoe (S3)- Hammer of Raijin is unpleasant. Even if Vanille silences Geddoe on the first turn and after tanking HoR, she is dead to his follow up physical.
Vanille vs Rosa (FF4)-Status.

Rudo: 10-2. Rudo covers his bases well for someone with a very DL limited skillset. My kneejerk was that he's heavy champ level, but some of that depending on how you feel on him blocking ID.  He actually translates pretty much exactly as he should in the DL which is nice.
Fuse: 5-7. Can hang in Heavy. This field didn't punish him much for his status weaknesses; the main status here was ID and he blocks that.
Vanille: 1-11. Did not expect her to do that poorly, several of her matches were close.
« Last Edit: April 10, 2021, 01:40:05 PM by superaielman »
"Reputation is what other people know about you. Honor is what you know about yourself"- Count Aral Vorkosigan, A Civil Campaign
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<Ciato> he would be so kawaii as a chibi...

SnowFire

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Re: Proving Grounds Heavy- why not?
« Reply #2 on: April 08, 2021, 12:18:33 AM »
PS4 Kir loses horribly against everyone since Vanish no worky there, although frankly I'm not sure how much hype even Switch Kir should get for Vanish, it's a tactic that sounds wildly bad in-game.  (I guess PS4 Kir can maybe beat very-low-respect Sync?  Depends on what his elemental resists were.)

Vanille vs Claude (SO2)
Vanille needs to cut short her combo to hope for status before she gets OHKO'd, seems too unreliable to me.
Vanille vs Wugui (SH1)
Spoiled.
Vanille vs Sierra (S2)
Instant death.

Vanille vs Daos (Lufias)
I don't really remember Daos anymore, but didn't he rely on focusing hype?  Gonna assume Medic stratz come into play in a rarity in Heavy.
Vanille vs Ryu (BoF1)
Uhhh can dragon attacks be Pain'd?  Stat topic claims no, Rudra is status immune, so gonna assume Ryu eventually doubles and kills Vanille through her healing before she can Eidolon.
Vanille vs Sync (TotA)
Yeah I'm not THAT far down on Sync.
Vanille vs Hect (G3)

Despite being slower, I think she has this?  First off, Vanille can miss her turn 1 status.  Secondly, if she hits one of them (she probably mixes in both Fogs & Pains), Hect just does whatever isn't blocked - Armageddon if silenced, her best spell if phys blocked.  Granted, Vanille could maybe survive a spell assault by just healing a lot until Hect's MP runs out (unlike Ryu, Hect is slower than average) so phys blocking is probably more important, but I'm not so sure, I could see Hect 2HKOing even through some healing off Vanille's suspect HP and maybe not finishing resolving all the heals.  Close but eh.

Vanille vs Zapdos (PKMN)
Later-gens Zapdos can threaten both physical and magical damage, but against a higher damage average, so the phys beatdown option is gonna be kinda sad.  And Thunder has accuracy issues.  Will win if you let Pressure completely screw over FF13 characters by making all their moves cost an additional turn slot, though, more than halving their offense (5 actions -> 2 actions)!
Vanille vs Hiro (Lunar:EBC)
More fast ID.
Vanille vs Geddoe (S3)
Fast OHKO.
Vanille vs Rosa (FF4)
I think Rosa blocks silence, and Berserk is gg.

Vanille: 2-9
Kir PS4: Nope

Jo'ou Ranbu

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Re: Proving Grounds Heavy- why not?
« Reply #3 on: April 09, 2021, 08:22:03 PM »
why do you do this to me aiel

Fuse vs Claude C. Kenny (SO2) - Fuse actually shouldn't be that much faster than Claude after Awakening. The evade does give Fuse some issues, but he puts in a lot of pressure. Coup du grace could be an option, but uh Claude immunes ID. Palsy... yeaaaaaaaaaaaah, not respecting a lock with that when Fuse can only do it somewhat reliably when he's under Awakening (the duration on that, man).
Fuse vs Wugui (SH1) - Fighter. Status immune. Check please - not even the durability hit from BloodChalice helps Wugui.
Fuse vs Odd Eye (SF2) - Between the status odds and the initiative, I think Fuse just doesn't get enough time to put down Odd Eye. Maybe if I saw him OHKOed post-Awakening, but no, the support's too good for that.
Fuse vs Sierra Mikain (S2) - Fuse should get a double before running out of JP, certainly, and he 2HKOs Sierra even without Awakening's status boost. THIS SAID, equipping the BloodChalice is a huge hit to his mdur - as in, he actually may get OHKOed by Sierra's Black Shadow (and uh, taking Dhyer's updated averages, she probably does). So uh yeah, nevermind.
Fuse vs Daos (Lufias) - EDIT: Daos is specifically weak to MACES. Oh well, it doesn't really matter, Fuse 4HKOs under Awakening, 3-2s constantly and isn't under real pressure here.
Fuse vs Ryu (BoF1) - Iunno, I think Fuse may actually land a coup du grace here in time even with Ryu's durability factoring in, since he takes his sweet time to untransform and transform back.
Fuse vs Sync (TotA) - Iunno, I see Sync as fragile enough to be chip-2HKOed by Fuse post-Awakening. Considering he doesn't 2HKO Fuse even pre-Awakening at full HP, that is not good.
Fuse vs Hect (G3) - The question is: does Hect get two turns with Awakened Fuse frozen? She really needs to, because he 2HKOs her ass and she doesn't get a second shot at Freeze to do so. Given we have no updated notes on Hect, I... dunno, I'll just abstain on Hect in general.
Fuse vs Zapdos (PKMN) - Even with Thunder's accuracy issues, I think Agility puts a lot of pressure on Fuse.
Fuse vs Hiro (Lunar:EBC) - Not much to say, I'll never play EBC at this point in my life.
Fuse vs Geddoe (S3) - Hammer of Raijin is faster. Good night, everybody!
Fuse vs Rosa Farrel (FF4) - Berserk kinda wrecks Fuse's game at worst, I think, and I kinda don't respect Palsy locks even against slow people, especially given Rosa's MEvade is actually pretty decent. Even at higher speed, I can't really expect 6HKO physicals to scare Rosa at all, especially once she piles an additional Mini to the fray.

Rudo Marco vs Claude C. Kenny (SO2) - I'd be willing to say White Conviction doesn't hit Claude's Light immunity, but Clean Military Rule does. This... creates some PROBLEMS for Rudo, especially since Claude can circumvent counters with Ripper Blast.
Rudo Marco vs Wugui (SH1) - As above, this means Rudo just OHKOs Wugui's ass and that's all she wrote.
Rudo Marco vs Odd Eye (SF2) - Clean Military Rule OHKOs and Rudo even has a case for going first. Not that it MATTERS, anyway.
Rudo Marco vs Sierra Mikain (S2) - I'm more and more amenable to taking threat range as turn one speed these days, which means Rudo is faster than Sierra and OHKOs. This... is going to happen a lot in this field.
Rudo Marco vs Daos (Lufias) - Oh good lord.
Rudo Marco vs Ryu (BoF1) - Chips with White Conviction, closes the deal with Clean Military Rule if Ryu tries to detransform cheese, I think.
Rudo Marco vs Sync (TotA) - Rudo either tanks a fucking Mystic Arte and kills Sync with his own turn+counter if he goes first or just counter+splatters him if he goes last. Jesus christ.
Rudo Marco vs Hect (G3) - I don't need updated notes for this. Clean Military Rule OHKOs.
Rudo Marco vs Zapdos (PKMN) - Pretty sure not a whole lot can keep Zapdos from dying to Rudo on average.
Rudo Marco vs Hiro (Lunar:EBC) - Rudo doesn't immune ID, I think, that's kind of a problem.
Rudo Marco vs Geddoe (S3) - Oh my, Geddoe 2HKOs first with Thunder Storm.
Rudo Marco vs Rosa Farrel (FF4) - Another OHKO.

Oerba Dia Vanille vs Claude C. Kenny (SO2) - I still think Dhyer's topic undersells FF13 status a lot, though I see where he comes from in it, so I'm still amenable to seeing Pain hit turn one and Claude has really no recourse against it.
Oerba Dia Vanille vs Wugui (SH1) - I feel amenable to seeing Vanille resist Wugui's ID with her blockers, which makes it turn never (he can't recast it, I think, and it actually can miss, if very rarely?). And Commando physicals are shockingly not -horrible-, who'da thunk.
Oerba Dia Vanille vs Odd Eye (SF2) - Not really.
Oerba Dia Vanille vs Sierra Mikain(S2) - So, this frankly depends on whether Vanille hits Fog turn one assuming death blockers can reduce the accuracy of Deadly Fingertips below 100% (Sierra does 2HKO through Vanille's healing with Final Bell/Black Shadow), and Sierra has unremarkable mdef and shitty Luck. This said... don't think I feel amenable to seeing the Death blockers work in this particular case, mainly because only actual spell evasion makes Deadly Fingertips/Final Bell fail in-game outside of full immunity. So, tough luck.
Oerba Dia Vanille vs Daos (Lufias) - Daos 2HKOs through Vanille's healing. His focused damage is stupid, honestly.
Oerba Dia Vanille vs Ryu (BoF1) - Vanille just gets heal-locked.
Oerba Dia Vanille vs Sync (TotA) - Another heal-lock, Sync's damage actually isn't trash at full HP. Vanille is shockingly bad against Heavy bosses.
Oerba Dia Vanille vs Hect (G3) - Another abstain.
Oerba Dia Vanille vs Zapdos (PKMN) - Zapdos is one whose stats I respect enough to crack Vanille status below turn one and he should be able to Agility into a 2HKO here. She doesn't even have a guaranteed win if she lands either status anyway because of him hitting both defenses off -that- speed...
Oerba Dia Vanille vs Hiro (Lunar:EBC) - See Sierra, really.
Oerba Dia Vanille vs Geddoe (S3) - Hammer of Raijin is horrible murder.
Oerba Dia Vanille vs Rosa Farrel (FF4) - Rosa does immune Silence with Rune Armlets at worst and Berserk+Mini - or, more realistically, Confuse - once again works its magic here.

Fuse: 5-6
Rudo: 10-2
Vanille: 2-9
« Last Edit: April 12, 2021, 09:14:14 PM by Jo'ou Ranbu »
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Random Consonant

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Re: Proving Grounds Heavy- why not?
« Reply #4 on: April 09, 2021, 08:45:14 PM »
Fuse vs Claude (SO2) - Nope.
Fuse vs Wugui (SH1) - Ignores every trick Wugui has.
Fuse vs Odd Eye (SF2)
Fuse vs Sierra (S2) - I'll buy BloodChalice being too big of a hit here.
Fuse vs Daos (Lufias) - L3 Daos just OHKOs, L2 Daos... yeah that 3x blunt weakness is probably gonna get his scrubby ass killed.
Fuse vs Hect (G3) - Abstain on Hect.
Fuse vs Zapdos (PKMN) - Yeah Zapdos halving Fighting is really not something Fuse needed here.
Fuse vs Hiro (Lunar:EBC)
Fuse vs Geddoe (S3) - Hammer of Raijin is faster?  Welp.
Fuse vs Rosa (FF4) - Berserk+Mini makes a vicious mockery of Fuse.

Dark Holy Elf

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Re: Proving Grounds Heavy- why not?
« Reply #5 on: April 13, 2021, 02:38:11 PM »
Fuse vs Claude (SO2): Yeah no.
Fuse vs Wugui (SH1): BloodChalice is a big hit (+24% NE magic damage plus a significant speed loss) but Wugui misses the 2HKO even with that.
Fuse vs Odd Eye (SF2): Way too much pressure.
Fuse vs Sierra (S2): With BloodChalice, Fuse is too slow to lap with Awakening, and is getting horribly mangled by Sierra's boosted damage. His only hope is to land paralysis, and Sierra's MDef is shockingly mediocre so he does have a 100% rate, but the problem is that Sierra is faster so he loses if it wears off in one turn and wins only if it lasts three, I think? My... guess is the odds don't favour Fuse there but I really have no idea. I might just abstain for now.
Fuse vs Daos (Lufias): Sadly I do allow focusing, so Fuse is relying on doubleturns to do anything, and I dunno that he can afford to use Awakening much. That said... yeah, Daos sucks, Fuse gets enough doubles without Awakening to seal the deal probably.
Fuse vs Ryu (BoF1): uhhhh. Ryu tries to heal-lock here I imagine. He's quite a bit faster BUT Fuse can evade... unless he's healing. I don't think he gets enough attacks in to coup de grace against Ryu's high def though. And sooner or later Ryu will crit and OHKO.
Fuse vs Sync (TotA): Sync probably just does too much damage below 75% health, and Fuse has no way to avoid this.
Fuse vs Hect (G3): Freeze absolutely lasts at least 2 turns. Failing to OHKO or status out Hect turn 1 is very bad. (And she blocks paralysis.)
Fuse vs Zapdos (PKMN): Yeah I'd think so. Hard to see Fuse having any shot short of paralysis and that's unlikely to be effective against Zapdos's speed/special.
Fuse vs Hiro (Lunar:EBC): I dunno, BloodChalice speed hit again is a pretty big problem (and if Fuse doesn't do that, he loses surely). Hiro is 114%, Fuse with BloodChalice is 82% -> 130% which isn't enough to instantly lap anyone above average speed, so he can't afford to Awakening and thus gets 4-3ed and destroyed by Triple Sword. But... paralysis, again, gives a hope. Same situation as Sierra. Difference is Hiro is even faster so Fuse has less time to make this work... strongly tempted to vote Hiro here. In fact I think I will, 1.5 votes against for Fuse vs. Sierra/Hiro sounds right.
Fuse vs Geddoe (S3): Fuse does half lightning at a speed hit so Geddoe only has one shot of really good damage. That said Geddoe can partly heal-lock with stun physicals (needs two) and he's faster at first (actually only barely slower even after Awakening). Fuse opts for turn 1 Awakening but it's hard to see him putting on pressure to win before Geddoe stuns him, hits him again, then erases him with Hammer of Raijin. Geddoe meanwhile is immune to palsy, which is unfortunate for Fuse because otherwise I think this is a fight that it definitely would tilt.
Fuse vs Rosa (FF4): Surely.

Rudo vs Claude (SO2): I'm... inclined to vote with the crowd but not certain. Definitely a fight Claude wishes he could set three killer moves to seal the deal, but I think healthy respect for Ripper Blast should barely carry this.
Rudo vs Wugui (SH1): Rudo vs. instant death is interesting... is petrify immunity close enough in a game without ID? Y... yeah probably. As Super notes, Wugui does probably avoid a one-shot.
Rudo vs Odd Eye (SF2): Rudo should 2HKO at worst, and Odd Eye can't use physicals until the finisher.
Rudo vs Sierra (S2): Go first and OHKO? Seems right.
Rudo vs Daos (Lufias): Hahahaha.
Rudo vs Ryu (BoF1): Rudo only 4HKOs, while Ryu transforms and then 3HKOs, and is faster? Ryu is not easy to kill with physicals, even Rudo-level ones.
Rudo vs Sync (TotA): Rudo tanks two Sync turns at 100% then 50-75%, and I think he probably chips then kills? Could be argued.
Rudo vs Hect (G3): And this is why Hect is Heavy despite usually winning when she gets a turn.
Rudo vs Zapdos (PKMN)
Rudo vs Hiro (Lunar:EBC): Hinges on death immunity.
Rudo vs Geddoe (S3): Faster 2HKO.
Rudo vs Rosa (FF4)

Vanille vs Claude (SO2): Definitely see Pain as turn 1, yeah, as per Jo'ou. And Vanille can barely survive one Mirror Slice, so she should get more like 1.5 turns anyway.
Vanille vs Wugui (SH1): Yeah, if Game of Death is actually OPB then Vanille just needs to get her death resistance to notably over 50%. Two death blockers is 70% resistance but Vanille takes ~38% more damage. Nightmare now 3HKOs (the physical is better but this is useless). Two turns of Vanille healing will MOSTLY erase this but not quite entirely, so she may need to waste an extra turn now and then. Vanille meanwhile probably 5HKOs. Crediting her as effectively faster in practice, she will go attack, attack, attack, heal, attack, attack. That's one Game of Death and four Nightmares? Yeah that should still favour Vanille I think. Surprisingly good fight.
Vanille vs Odd Eye (SF2): Too much pressure.
Vanille vs Sierra (S2): Sierra being faster means she's very likely to win a status-off. To make matters worse, two death blockers would get Vanille OHKOed, so she can only use one and is thus in really bad shape.
Vanille vs Daos (Lufias): Oh man TERROR WAVE have we really come to this. The stat topic kinda antihypes it but yeah it gets the job done since one Terror Wave is enough to heal-lock, when means Vanille only makes progress on doubleturns and she needs 5-6 attacks to win probably? Nah, less, Deshell is a thing. Four attacks. Still..... yeah probably Daos.
Vanille vs Ryu (BoF1): If Pain land then Ryu instantly dies, but dragons are status immune. So Ryu obviously transforms right away. I... think I'd still see Deprotect/Deshell working (dragons aren't immune to stat debuffs). As usual once transformed he's gonna 2HKO constantly, so Vanille wants to blitz him back. She'll need three attacks to win, she gets one immediately, but then she's just heal-locked until Ryu doubles or crits.
Vanille vs Sync (TotA): I'm not sure why Sync respect matters here. Even if you see him as 5PCHP he's gonna lose because his full-HP damage isn't good enough to beat Vanille, so she can turtle until she summons, unless that strategy is specifically banned.
Vanille vs Hect (G3): Hect can't block Pain or Fog, but Vanille needs to land both. No Pain = Freeze. No Fog = Hect nearly OHKOs with Heaven's Gate and this probably does overcome Vanille's healing in time. (Or just until Pain wears off). Vanille really needs to land BOTH statuses against Hect's really high MDef.
Vanille vs Zapdos (PKMN): Zapdos can 2HKO with an opening Thunder + whatever Vanille doesn't land on turn 1. Assuming her status is even still turn 1 against Zapdos stats.
Vanille vs Hiro (Lunar:EBC): Hiro's death being less accurate gives Vanille a bit more room to manuever than against Sierra. Vanille sets one death blocker and prays to land Pain which basically destroys Hiro. I... think this probably works, actually. Hiro is now doing very near OHKO so maybe he just spams Triple Sword and hopes a finisher wind spell does it? Actually... yes, that does work. And Vanille's healing isn't full so she can't heal away the problem. If Vanille goes with no death blockers than Hiro just uses Concussion Sword and going first gives him the edge in a status-off (I don't see slower 70% beating faster 50% these days).
Vanille vs Geddoe (S3): Geddoe is immune to Fog and OHKOs.
Vanille vs Rosa (FF4): Blocks silence, does her thing.

Rudo 9-3 (the field is very light on evadable/melee/physical spoilers which helped him, but he's definitely solid)
Vanille 3-9 (bit of a tough field for her, though it does show how reliant she is on Pain/Fog in Heavy)
Fuse 2-9 (with some uncertainty on Sierra and Hiro)
« Last Edit: April 14, 2021, 05:55:46 AM by Dark Holy Elf »

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