Author Topic: CK's Cartoon Corner  (Read 38685 times)

Cmdr_King

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Re: CK's Cartoon Corner
« Reply #300 on: August 06, 2018, 12:08:35 AM »
Steven Universe (Season 1)

Steven Universe is the show humanity needed, and I hope it wasn’t too late.

Okay, wait.  Basics.  Steven Universe pops at a basic entertainment level.  The character designs are distinct and immediately eye-catching, episodes never go too far in one emotional direction or another multiple in a row, their use of foreshadowing and planting plot devices in advance in a low-key but still memorable way is among the best I’ve seen for a kid-focused show.  Especially considering that they’re clearly aiming to be showable in nearly any order while still actually having a clear and strict timeline from episode to episode if you’re binging it.  They don’t always do the best job hiding their animation limits, sometimes their use of expression can drift into too formulaic, but how anyone can think this looks interchangeable with half a dozen other shows I’ll never understand.

Also there are so many homages to other shows.  Also video games, somewhat unexpectedly.  They borrow the robot master select screen from Mega Man 3 at one point.  Pearl is a walking reference to Revolutionary Girl Utena.  Garnet’s Universe is a series of Dragonball references, but then the final attack is almost certainly a Giga Drill Break.  It’s worth noting they only rarely actually change the animation style, but the way they adapt elements of these shows into their own style has its own charm.

Also holy shit I am CONVINCED that the big battle in Ocean Gem was using a background track ripped from an unmade Kingdom Hearts game.  They summoned the very soul of Yoko Shimomura, and I love them forever.

The show’s focus is on characters and relationships, so obviously the characters are pretty good.  It’s worth noting mostly how each new cast addition manages to bring a new balance and set of traits to the overall pie, and that’s starting with 5 primary characters.  Each new one keeps managing to be a new favorite, only for one of the Gems to do something great and new, but then the new characters add another layer and aaaaaaaaaa.  It’s great.  I mean, there are exceptions, but…

Weakest Episode- Keep Beach City Weird.  I don’t have much interesting to say about this one.  Actually I considered not even bothering because no episodes really stood out as tedious or offensive or anything.  But I remembered some internet lists calling this one the worst and… yeah probably.  Ronaldo isn’t great at the best of time, and he’s just the worst sort of asshole here, and then they give up and feed him fresh delusions in the end.  I mean I… geeeet it I guess but bleh.

But mostly Steven Universe is a show about the strength of compassion.  Steven doesn’t just have near-global empathy, and it’s not just a source of strength.  Like, sure, the show totally pulls moments of “I FIGHT FOR MY FRIENDS” heroic resolve, but only one or two belong to Steven.  And they’re more about keeping him moving than striking down his foes.
Steven Universe doesn’t just feel for everyone, and see the pain behind fear and hatred.  He has the strength to understand, at some impossible intuitive level, that everything they inflict on him is just a fraction of the hurt that brought them where they are.  He will heal, he can shield himself, and he can take it, because not doing so instead means he has to suffer seeing another living thing, hurt and scared and almost always alone, die.

All the best episodes of Steven Universe come back to this theme, in one way or another.  So Many Birthdays really shows off how Steven thinks of the Gems and how badly he needs them both to love him and each other.  Monster Buddies uh… is kinda the episode I was describing with the “hurt and scared and alone” thing.  An Indirect Kiss delves into Steven himself a bit more, showing where the edges of the hole never knowing his mother lie.

I’d be remiss not to mention Alone Together, but I’ll admit I didn’t get a lot out of it personally.  Like the way it can reflect the experience of the world suddenly noticing you growing up is absolutely a thing that’s pretty obvious, it’s not something I ever really experience?  I mean when people randomly hit on me as a young teen I knew they were making fun of me and instead developed a healthy complex about that instead!  Totally different.

Buuuuuuuuuuut….

Best Episode- Oh my god Mirror Gem.  This is such an encapsulation of the entire show.  Steven gets one idea in his head, it leads him to some Gem tech, he does kid stuff with it… but it turns out the key is his boundless empathy, and trying to help something that seems dangerous.  But it goes off script at this point because for the first (although probably not the last) time in the show there’s not a clear resolution: Lapis says her clearly heartbroken goodbye and runs of.  And sure the very next episode has the Gems confronting her, but it too has no clear-cut “just do what we’ve been doing” resolution.  More than that the way they loop the voice clips to characterize Lapis while she’s still in the mirror is inspired, and her reactions afterwards keep adding little layers.  Season 1 (which seems to really be two seasons but the show retroactively put them together for some internal reason) shows Lapis in exactly five episodes but that adds up to so much personality my jealousy is unbound.
I also feel sorta glad I don’t really date after watching stuff like this.  I feel like I’d have long since run head firsts to fix a problem person and dashed myself on the rocks way before figuring out how to remotely help.

Something about this show inspires oversharing.  Must be the empathy high.

All that said I do have a bit of a cap on how much I can hype this season?  The ratio of episodes that absolutely popped to the good filler is a bit too lopsided for my tastes, and while the underlying message of the show is something that speaks to me so, so much it also can sometimes lose the thread when it needs to keep Steven… well, his age.  Whatever it is.  So I might undershoot the score a bit here, but it feels right in the moment.

Oh.  Yes.

Whoever said “CK is Pearl” is right to a degree I think Rebecca Sugar might be inside my head and it’s weird.  Stop being so right you right person.

Rating- 8/10
CK: She is the female you
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<NotMiki> I mean, we're talking life vs. liberty, with the pursuit of happiness providing color commentary.

Captain K

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Re: CK's Cartoon Corner
« Reply #301 on: August 06, 2018, 01:02:47 AM »
Incredibles 2
and Voyd is adorable and I’ll not hear otherwise.

Got to disagree there, all the new super heroes were terribly designed and not interesting at all. I think that's one of the biggest problems with the movie: too much screentime for the boring new heroes and not enough Incredible family.

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Re: CK's Cartoon Corner
« Reply #302 on: August 06, 2018, 12:45:06 PM »
Yay! You watched Steven Universe! And you have basically the exact reaction I was expecting and hoping for! I hope it brings you more joy as you start getting into the real meat of the series from here.

Cmdr_King

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Re: CK's Cartoon Corner
« Reply #303 on: September 30, 2018, 12:05:23 AM »
Gravity Falls (Season 1)


The thing about perpetually coming late to the party, especially for a completed series like Gravity Falls, is you tend to get people’s impressions based on how things end, not how they’re received as they air.  So in that respect the oddest thing about Season 1 is how much of a slow burn it is.  ‘course, considering it spent a year and a half airing 20 episodes, and included a lot of overt elements to intrigue fans between episodes, it’s a fair argument to say that watching all of them over the span of a few days isn’t the intended means.

I don’t really plan to dig into that side of the show, although if I want to keep going with it after season 2 that’s not a bad idea.  But having not been there I dunno if that outsider perspective is useful.  And of course, being a slow burn is hardly a bad thing, just a surprising thing.

Fundamentally the first season is actually a very typical show for the demographic.  Sitcom-ish setup mostly based in exploring childhood, coming of age, the first clashes between budding adults and their caretakers, that sorta thing.  And considering the love for the cast, that’s actually to be expected.  But the supernatural elements, the mystery so boldly jammed straight into the center of that opening?  Gravity Falls plays very coy with it all.  Oh sure, there’s usually a touchstone moment (typically a single line of dialog) of Dipper remarking on the weirdness of the town, and usually there’s some abnormal element attached to the week’s lesson/problem, but until Gideon Rises really only the first episode goes all in on weirdness.

Now having a general idea of the ending I know that slow burn goes very fast very quickly once it starts picking up, but here we’re really focused on making sure we understand who the cast are and how they function as a unit. 
To that end I’m a bit mixed: I know he’s not, but I have trouble thinking of Dipper as not being the “boring main character” type.  No mistake, he has traits, the way the show sets him up to start taking on the pretenses demanded of masculinity only for the episode’s lesson to kick it right back to pieces is very much appreciated, but… I dunno?  It’s hard to get a sense for him because he’s starting this journey not as a boy but as unshaped clay.  We don’t know who he is because he doesn’t seem to have really defined himself at all.  Dipper will depend entirely on where he ends this journey and… well, this is the middle.

Mabel… oh Mabel.  Why aren’t there more real Mabels?  Okay that’s unfair, we can’t actually have that many before we reach complete global saturation, but I think everyone needs a Mabel in their lives.  Not so much a shoulder devil as a shoulder sister, who reminds you to keep your head in the clouds and find joy in other people sometimes.  And yet that’s not to say she doesn’t have worries, or depth.  But there’s a deep sense of who she wants to be at the core of Mabel’s being, and her conflicts are when she starts to doubt if she can be that person, or if that person can find a place among others.  The contrast between that and Dipper’s quest to find that for himself forms the core of the series really, and even here you can see that they both know this and fear what it may bring.  Or rather, fear that it might mean they might become people who don’t love each other anymore.  But I think going into that should probably wait until the series is done.

The rest of the Mystery Shack crew are a bit one note, with asterisks all over the place.  Grunkle Stan sits upon a throne of lies made from a house of cards, and more than anything else the season finale wants you to know that throne is going to start crumbling down very, very soon.  Soos… his moments are great but his baseline sometimes gets a bit creepy I’m afraid.  Wendy is who the plot needs her to be at this point, but they leave themselves plenty of room to go places with her.  It’s a strange way to handle the supporting cast really, because while they slot easily into a lot of different stories there’s plenty here for people to glom into if that’s the character for them?  I’m not sure how to describe the vibe they give off exactly, almost like a +1 Archetype if you will.

I’m going to skip the episode honors this time around, but I do want to single out one for further discussion.

Too Real- The Hand That Rocks the Mabel.  Okay, so a lot Dipper’s quest for identity is him trying on and quickly rejecting a lot of aspects of… let’s call it traditional masculinity.  He wants to be masculine, indeed he seems in quite a hurry to be a man, but at every turn he keeps finding out that all the usual ways manhood is defined involves hurting others.  It’s common enough that I’m comfortable saying a big part of Gravity Falls as a show is exploring masculinity and trying to find a form of it that works today.  And in that light this episode, Gideon’s debut, is something that had to be here.  The degree to which Gideon cultivates the mask of the classic Nice Guy is almost unnerving.  It’s all an act, not just in the way any “Nice Guy” is ultimately not sincere but in a “he’s a swindler intentionally creating a persona of being a Nice Guy” sense.  He’s so villainous he doesn’t even realize the act he’s putting on is a red flag to someone who’s appropriately cynical even when pulled off flawlessly.

And gotta say, it’s a hell of a thing to watch the episode lay this all out?  The manipulations Gideon pulls out to keep getting those reluctant “yes” agreements from Mabel is so textbook it’s eerie.  He breaks down in the way of all abusers, something that seems especially potent on the day this is being posted.  But they never go full throttle with it, which I appreciate.  It makes it a lot easier to send younger audiences away with the core lesson: if you say no, and they keep asking, leave.  Run away.  If they won’t take no the first time they won’t take no ever, and teaching people that red flag is something I’m glad to see.

Mmm.  Writing this out I’m definitely finding some angles to really get a better bead on the first half of the show, but I gotta admit, my actual experience with the show wasn’t amazing by any stretch.  It’s good!  And the seeds for sheer awesome are absolutely there.  But just as 20 episodes of television…

Rating- 7/10
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<NotMiki> I mean, we're talking life vs. liberty, with the pursuit of happiness providing color commentary.

Captain K

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Re: CK's Cartoon Corner
« Reply #304 on: September 30, 2018, 01:55:09 PM »
Oh boy get ready for Season 2.

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Re: CK's Cartoon Corner
« Reply #305 on: October 13, 2018, 01:15:37 PM »
Gravity Falls (Season 2)

Dipper Pines and the Quest for Manliness (Part 2).

Season 2 does try to keep a lid on the secrets it unveiled at the end of the last season, but that’s used deliberately to build tension, it gives things a much more concrete feel of building pressure than season 1’s slow burn.  And mostly they use this time to start giving more dimensions to Soos and Wendy. 

Wendy turns pure Action Girl, on the premise of “how else does the lone girl in a family of lumberjacks function”.  It works, but also since it means she gets to see Dipper be something other than “awkward dork with an obvious crush on her”, they get to form more of a… I don’t wanna say partnership, but a camaraderie.  While Dipper visibly has a small hope in the back of his mind that maybe, y’know, someday when the gap in their ages isn’t so relatively large things could go back in a romantic direction, he’s also managed to internalize the idea that they spend time together without that being the focal point.  But more than that, since she gets to do things besides be disaffected at everything, it’s a lot easier to appreciate her dry snark.  It’s certainly a great primer for the finale’s buildup at any rate.

Soos… the two big Soos-focused episodes this season are commonly cited as people’s favorite episodes, and they’re certainly not wrong.  For our purposes they also tie nicely into the overarching themes of masculinity.  Soos and the Real Girl shows a thorough knowledge of some dark, dark corners of the internet, and does a good job of showing both the temptation of those sorts of behaviors and why a good person would never fully fall into it.  If anything the trouble Soos has is that he cares too much about the game, making him easy to manipulate for GIFfany.  Blendin’s Game now, that’s magical.  As a contained story it might be the best one in the series?  But despite Soos feeling a bit disconnected from the rest of the cast earlier in the show, mostly since his attachment to Stan is played as pathetic, this one episode moves him fully and naturally into the family.  It also brings some subtle cues for how the show views masculinity; Soos is mostly harmless before, but here we see just how deep the goodness at his core goes, and that’s almost entirely him just learning his own form of manhood.  Stan certainly had affection for him at some level, but he just wasn’t emotionally mature enough to fill that Dad-shaped void in Soos’ life.  They made it work, but Soos still had to be his own guide.  And ultimately this is the lesson Dipper has to pick up in the end, and fitting all that road mapping into this one episode is great.

Not What He Seems is the fulcrum point of the series.  Everything before is designed to bring us to the moment Mable has to choose whether or not to hit a button and close the portal Stan’s spent most of his life trying to open.  Dipper, who’s spent all summer becoming ever more disillusioned with everyone in his life, the repeated failed models for adulthood, and Stan most of all.  Or the consummate con man, completely sincere and desperate for perhaps the first time in his entire life. 
A man like Stan can’t change overnight of course.  He almost immediately reverts to type once this moment is past, but the foundation has been at last shaken.  I guess in theory you could say just having the kids around, reminding him of better days, before the only true bond he formed in his life was broken, started that process, but that moment of trust is the beginning of the end.  He can’t forgive Ford yet, but the 30 years of stasis running the Mystery Shack and searching for his brother is over, and he noticeably becomes a more complete person in each episode.  Still a trouble maker and a scammer, but with a more adventurous spirit, with clearer moral boundaries, and with less and less spite.
Put another way, the Stan Pines in the first episode wouldn’t have even stayed in town once Weirdmageddon began.  The Stan Pines in Not What He Seems would never have invited Bill into his mind to be erased.  It’s a long road, but he finds something worth caring about again, and even grows enough to try again with Ford.

Since Dipper is, in the end, the focus of the show’s core arc, we’ll talk about Mabel first.  Like I said for season 1, Mabel is a character who knows who she wants to be, and instead struggles with whether the world will let her be herself.  The idea that people are supposed to change as they grow up, and seeing the ways the world gets worse and worse as you approach adulthood terrifies her, because she can’t see a way of being a good person there.  Her sense of right and wrong tells her everything she sees about high school is wrong, and the idea of living that every day is… a lot.
More than that Mabel is basically Kamina.  Don’t worry if you don’t know that name, because the relevant comparison is conveniently boiled down to a single quote. 
“I was at the end of my rope.  But Simon kept on digging away.  His drilling let me put on a brave face… whenever I feel timid and weak, whenever I feel like I’m losing confidence, I think back to the sight of his back all hunched over, digging away.  I think to myself ‘I won’t be laughed at by that back’”.
So too with Mabel and Dipper.  His stodgy persistence is the mechanism by which Mabel’s sense of justice steers itself.  Without him, she can keep going out of sheer momentum, but eventually she’ll dash upon the rocks.  But his mere presence let’s her be Mabel, one who won’t let down that nerd.

Ford is very much set up as the role model Dipper has been looking for.  A man with the same dedication to truth and knowledge as Dipper, who can actually teach him how to turn that part of himself into a life.  It’s very likely the first time in his entire life Dipper sees a way to become his own person, someone he would even want to be.  And that sort of thing can really blind you to the growing they still have to do.
Ford is exactly as self-centered as his brother, it just manifests in a completely different way.  He loves the idea of solving the world’s big mysteries, of changing the world and human understanding of it, which can be noble.  But mostly it just means that he did it, he fulfilled his destiny, the destiny of all smarty pantses; he did a great thing, and everyone will know he did it.  Now, Ford is still more emotionally mature than Stan.  It might be a bit abstract for him, but he knows that it’s important to make sure people like and respect you overall, life’s easier that way.  And certainly if there’s a risk of ending the world you won’t really accomplish much by letting that go down.  But like his brother he only truly connects with other people again once he meets Dipper and Mabel.  An emotionally aware person wouldn’t go 20 plus years without realizing his brother was devastated and made a rash decision in weakness before making contact again, y’see.

So Stan and Ford’s arcs don’t conclude until well into Weirdmageddon, because how else could things go.  But more generally because it was important for the ritual to fail, because showing the depths malformed masculinity go is key to putting a proper bow on the show’s broader themes.  There’s a nice layer of having the first bond formed between members of the circle be the last to heal, of showing just how profound the break between the brothers was, but under that is where the show comes together.  Stan and Ford are old men, who became men in very lonely, misinformed ways.  For men like them, problems aren’t prevented by communicating dangers between people.  And they aren’t solved once problems rear their heads but before they become catastrophes through the cooperation and affection between different peoples.  They’re solved at the last moment before the end, through the sacrifice of ‘disposable’ men.
How much of world history has gone that way?  Most?  All?  I feel like we’re living through several of those scenarios right now, except the sacrifices are 20% of the world’s population living in coastal regions.  But depressing comments on the nature of humanity aside, it also sheds some light on reversing Stan’s sacrifice in the end.  Stan’s stubborn masculinity doesn’t have to be the way.  We don’t have to accept that such sacrifices are necessary, because we’ve learned better ways.  And dipping back into the show’s weirdness?  If Ford learns those lessons, well, of course Stan learns them by proxy, no?  I mean, what human ‘magic’ goes further back than twins?

So what sort of man is Dipper Pines?  Well, he’s not one, because he doesn’t have to be just yet.  I think he learned, more scientifically of course, the lesson Soos accidented his way into: don’t be any one man.  Look at the examples of others, see the pieces that feel right for you, and weave them into your life.  And really the twin magic strikes again, but fittingly as inverses for fraternal twins.  Mabel has a sense of right and wrong, but not always the courage to trust it.  Dipper always trusts his instincts, but doesn’t always have his right/wrong compass calibrated.  The bond between them not only makes them better, but each of them can’t steer a proper course without the other.

So let’s touch on the everything else before wrapping up.  Because the internet has a lot, and I mean so much, of content touching on the quality of the show’s animation and homages or the way it weaves mysteries into the show.  And that stuff’s great, but I haven’t invested the time or energy to really catalogue it better than others. 
The way those things interact with the extended cast is worth noting though.  I usually walk into a series knowing the broad strokes of its story, but even with that there’s a lot of satisfaction to stuff like McGucket finding his identity, and seeing all the pieces falling into place as the story goes.  The show admitting outright that Blubs and Durland were lovers in the end is nice and feels like rewarding the viewer for paying attention the same way the mystery clues did.  There’s a few others I’ve forgotten between watching and writing, but the show taking the cast just as seriously as the mystery gives the show a much stronger feel than a lot of this type.

Rating- 9/10.  In the end I do feel kinda disconnected from the show, and never quite got the huge feels from it, but damn if rating it any lower doesn’t feel like an immense disservice.

PS: Oh my god the Mabel shorts are SO GOOD.   Just so good you guys.
CK: She is the female you
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<NotMiki> I mean, we're talking life vs. liberty, with the pursuit of happiness providing color commentary.

Cmdr_King

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Re: CK's Cartoon Corner
« Reply #306 on: November 19, 2018, 01:33:25 PM »
Chicken Little

So I watched this a couple days ago and mostly forgot it.  Rather than do the simple thing of watching it again, I think writing things out to remember them will more accurately capture what this movie is about.  Chicken Little is in the running for worst film of the Disney Animation Studios canon, and while the other two most-cited contenders aren’t movies I’ve seen, that’s definitely a fair statement.  And the reasons why it fails are best illustrated by this lack of memorability.

The problems start immediately, with the movie rapidly flipping through several Disney fairy tale opening options, calling each cliché.  Aside from being a cliché itself even in 2005 thanks to Dreamworks, you’re priming your audience to require subversion; reminding people there’s nothing new under the sun means you need to surprise them much more than something that makes no such pretense.  The truly damning thing is this isn’t the tone of the movie at all.  It’s a little weird, and the contemporary setting is even now rare for Disney films, but fundamentally it isn’t trying to subvert children’s fables, it’s stretching desperately to make one fill 90 minutes (and coming up short even then).

From there the opening act sets up the apparent core conflict, with Chicken Little’s panicked declaration that the sky is falling falling on deaf ears, including those of his father, whose only goal in life is seemingly to pass through it entirely unnoticed.  A better movie might have turned this into a scathing critique of political and moral apathy, but instead it later chooses to be a Disney movie about family reconciliation. Like… Dad whose name I won’t dignify by looking up, the problem wasn’t that you have no faith in your son, it’s that you have no faith in anything!  Rather than pay the slightest attention to what’s going on in your world, you heard someone speaking out of turn and scolded them to calm down, because anything that draws attention to yourself is automatically bad.  That’s a much deeper problem that having a heart-to-heart 10 minutes before credits roll doesn’t fix.

But even knowing it doesn’t go anywhere, and setting aside that the storybook opening has already ruined the movie’s tone, this could still have worked.  But then the movie tortures logic for a while.  Chicken Little is scared to confront his dad (sure), so he figures the better solution is to win the town’s trust (…okay).  And the best path to do that is to become a town hero (losing the plot here), so he’ll become the start player of the local baseball team.  At this point I’m pretty sure the actual problem of the movie is they wanted desperately to satirize American culture but weren’t good enough writers to actually SAY anything.  The reasoning in the movie seems to be “people will listen to anything a celebrity says, therefore all I have to do is become the best baseball player in town and I win!”  And if it was something Chicken Little wanted to do for other reasons, or had the slightest previous skill in, or wasn’t specifically designed so it would take a miracle for this plan to work, or even if the plan completely failed and he had to come up with something that he was legitimately good at instead, all of those are better story ideas that could give it thematic heft.  Instead it’s basically a way to revert the movie world to the status quo it had before the opening scene, except it wastes 20 minutes of screen time and steals the spotlight from a young tomboy.  That part comes back.

So.  We’re back to square one, and so Chicken Little manages to stumble upon the original cause of the invisible thing that hit his head.  Drumroll please!



Yup.  There was an invisible spaceship, they left behind their kid, and now they think he’s been kidnapped and they’ll wipe the town off the map looking for him.  It’s all a big misunderstanding and all Chicken Little has to do to save the day is be honest and get people to believe him!

Okay, so I guess it’s slightly unfair to say there’s no subversion here.  The entire thing does turn the moral of the original fairy tale on its head.  But that’s not the same thing as Shrek-style subversion, and it doesn’t really work even in the context of the story, because it’s not a gradual learning curve, he just tries the same thing repeatedly until accidental evidence is finally dumped on his lap in such quantities people finally listen.  And the whole thing is so padded and diluted that even that tiny thread of thematic thrust doesn’t really do anything.

And that’s the thing.  Nothing in this movie has any emotional weight.  The character models are notably ugly, which doesn’t help with garnering accidental empathy, but that’s the problem.  Any caring for the story or characters here would have to be carried by the physical acting because nothing in the story gives it space or detail to generate that response.  The cast is a bunch of comedy sidekicks not provided any good jokes, no one’s given the dramatic pathos to be effective, there’s no clear reasoning for the town’s hostility to Chicken Little in the first place even, which mostly matters because it seems pretty clear he was already a bit of an outcast before the opening scene but we never get to see it in action.  The only character I actually felt bad for was Foxy Loxy, because being brainwashed into a girly girl sits just that badly with me on principle.  Apparently there’s a scene I didn’t even notice where she actually bullies the main character, but considering the entire movie is bullying him for the crime of existing I probably wouldn’t have noticed even if I hadn’t completely checked out of caring by then.

Rating- 4/10.  As much as I’m ragging on it, the thing is it doesn’t manage to be actively offensive.  It’s just… nothing.  A flailing thing that leaves no impact at all.
CK: She is the female you
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<NotMiki> I mean, we're talking life vs. liberty, with the pursuit of happiness providing color commentary.

Captain K

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Re: CK's Cartoon Corner
« Reply #307 on: November 22, 2018, 10:10:13 AM »
There was also Home on the Range, which I remember nothing about except that Roseanne Barr was a cow.

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Re: CK's Cartoon Corner
« Reply #308 on: November 22, 2018, 02:08:09 PM »
Yeah, Home on the Range and Black Couldron are the other two I hear as “worst”, but i’ve Seen neither.
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<NotMiki> I mean, we're talking life vs. liberty, with the pursuit of happiness providing color commentary.

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Re: CK's Cartoon Corner
« Reply #309 on: November 22, 2018, 10:26:12 PM »
Black Cauldron is fine, just too dark for a Disney movie.

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Re: CK's Cartoon Corner
« Reply #310 on: November 22, 2018, 10:29:46 PM »
Yeah, I got the impression that it's... mediocre basically?  Like not really a good adaptation, not as good a "dark" movie as contemporary Bluth films, and not Disney enough to be on-brand, but perfectly watchable and mostly inoffensive.

Home of the Range sounds like a real contest for being super bad, but I missed a chance to snag a copy ~4 years ago and don't feel like going out of my way to track it down now.  If I find something I'll pick it up but *shrug*
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Re: CK's Cartoon Corner
« Reply #311 on: November 30, 2018, 12:47:16 PM »
Coraline

The first time I watched Coraline, I hadn’t really read any Neil Gaiman.  And while I still haven’t read Coraline, I’ve read some of his other work, I’ve seen some of his work on Doctor Who, I have a pretty solid grasp of Neil Gaiman’s quirks and the stamps he puts on his work.
I feel like I should have been able to tell Coraline was one of his without having been exposed to him yet.  Few things are more distilled essesnce of Gaiman than a story of a child learning the rules of ancient magical beings and engaging in battles of wits, aided by ordinary things infused with their folkloric properties and just a touch of modernity being foreign to magical monsters.
But let’s back up a bit.
I’d forgotten how much of a slow burn this was?  The events in the world behind the door escalate in their wish-fulfillment very slowly, and the back and forth between it and the real world lasts the bulk of the run time, in multiple verses.  And really the story wouldn’t work without it, being able to see Coraline’s frustration with reality build more and more, when she has ever better experiences with Other Mother to contrast it with?  It puts that little bit of a veil over the obvious evil behind a perfect world where everyone has buttons for eyes, and lets the viewer have that little bit of doubt that maybe they should want Coraline to stay too.  It also gives the sudden shift once Other Mother offers to let her stay in exchange for her eyes retain a horror vibe despite everything being so clearly too good to be real.
And what’s great is you need all those misdirects because Coraline herself is so smart.  Her natural impulse is to question everything around her: why is this like this, what’s over the hill, why can’t things be better.  The thing that makes her tempting to Other Mother, the desire to imagine something better, also makes her dangerous.  And presented with a hint, or a new fact, she’ll incorporate and utilize it very quickly.  It’s just kinda a joy to watch her be so vibrantly young and eager honestly.
Really it’s just a perfect primer for Neil Gaiman’s work, and that’s intensely valuable.  Horror without terror, skepticism without nihilism, honoring superstition and folklore without bowing to it, there’s a lot Gaiman does that few others have done, and the more people that explore those aspects of humanity the better.
So hey, let’s sing the praises of Laika.  This is their first work, and while you can certainly tell they were figuring out the limits of what they could and couldn’t do, there’s some pretty amazing stuff here.  What impresses me most is the tinier effects really.  They don’t do much of it for obvious reasons, but they do dabble in dust and electric effects, and knowing how stop-motion works it’s an amazing thing to even attempt, let alone pull off pretty well.  More than that the designs here are just wonderful, it’s all very stylized and distinct but never so much that the subtle off-ness of the other world immediately pops.  The fact that it’s wrong is still immediately obvious, but the delights therein are also just real enough to want to overlook it.
Much as I can wax on about Gaiman, Coraline does feel a bit insubstantial overall.  I can’t really quantify it exactly, but I guess the fact that it lacks any meatier happening than a single wicked witch means it never leaves the impression Gaiman’s weighter novels or Laika’s later work Kubo did.  Still impressive and well worth watching, but lacks the personal investment those gave me.
Rating- 7/10
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Re: CK's Cartoon Corner
« Reply #312 on: November 30, 2018, 02:49:30 PM »
Coraline before Coco?! #%$@!

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Re: CK's Cartoon Corner
« Reply #313 on: November 30, 2018, 03:34:50 PM »
Coco is so good!  I've watched it about three times to do it here and can't figure out how to approach it!
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Re: CK's Cartoon Corner
« Reply #314 on: December 09, 2018, 07:20:45 PM »
Ralph Breaks the Internet

This sequel feels more like a Disney movie than the original.  The Pixar-ian emphasis on creating the world of the original forms the backbone of that story, and having that in place is the only reason this film can have an entirely new setting but have the conflict it does.
Although I guess in a way the saturation of reference humor maybe makes this the Dreamworksiest of Disney films.

Since the Internet as a setting is way more about just the sheer scope and cute references, the main thrust here is the continuing relationship between Vanellope and Ralph.  And I want to lead off with that because in the end I think this is a slightly weaker movie because while they give a lot more screen time and care to that character dynamic it never quite has the same heart as the original.  No one moment has the sheer emotional punch of Ralph smashing the kart in the original.  I mean I can get myself to tear up just remembering that sitting here, there is no shame in not living up to that moment, but it’s just kinda the simplest way to summarize how I feel about the film overall.  So yeah: there’s nothing wrong with this, but it’s just not quite as special as the original in either emotional punch or creating an amazing world.  So let’s get to what’s working.

I do enjoy the main conceit at play here.  Sure, you and I could never make thousands of dollars on internet videos overnight, but we’re not living 80s video game villains who can create videos purely in time required to shoot.  And while it’s a bit of a sketch show at points because of it, mostly they’re kinda clever in their very precise mix of lameness and endearing qualities.  And just as a means to give Vanellope and Ralph things to share reactions to, it’s great.  You can really feel the six years of friendship they’ve built up, as a contrast to the growing rift between Ralph’s comfort with himself and Vanellope’s need to do something more with herself.

I think the degree to which they made Shank the coolest person in existence walked the line perfectly.  Being Gal Gadot helped immensely there, her particular accent makes her sound authentically badass no matter how she says it or what she’s saying, so she can be incredibly casual and use the game’s lingo but you never doubt for a second that she’s a stone cold killer under the right circumstances.
And let’s be real, that chase sequence in the middle of the Disney movie was one hell of an action beat and not remotely what anyone would expect.  Well, okay, they probably did once the full Fast and Furious vibe of that game was in the trailers but that’s not how Disney normally does action dangit.

I cannot understate how much Calhoun killed it every second she was on screen.

Rating- 7/10.  Be sure to stick around after the credits.
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Re: CK's Cartoon Corner
« Reply #315 on: December 16, 2018, 12:43:04 AM »
There was a scene in the trailer that wasn't in the movie and that makes me sad.

Yeah, didn't like it nearly as much as the first one. I found it too hard to believe Vanellope would abandon her friends that readily. And didn't the first film establish that going turbo was inherently bad?

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Re: CK's Cartoon Corner
« Reply #316 on: December 17, 2018, 07:06:43 PM »
Spider-Man: Into the Spider-verse

So why haven’t y’all watched this yet?
There’s some visual elements in the film I don’t want to give away to an unawares audience, but almost all my impressions of it are really based on them, so between that and the movie being out a mere weekend as I’m putting this up… yeah.  Go catch it on the big screen now, then come back to me.  It’s good, 8/10 stuff, but with plenty of bonuses.  Go!

Honestly the movie is self-evidently good to the point I want to start out with my most negative reaction: at a surface level this being so obviously A Spider-Man Movie that I wonder if it’s just a bit too generic.  The tale of Miles Morales hits the beats of the Spider-journey so thoroughly it’s very obvious.
And the movie makes that part of the narrative, turning what could have been an unfortunate implication, that the black latino Spider-Man has to be carried by all the others for his first movie, into a strength; anyone can be Spider-man if they try, and more importantly you could be Spider-Man.

I’ve rarely been in a theater and had an entire audience crack up as often as they did at Spider-verse.  A lot of the humor didn’t quite click for me, in part because I think some of the slapstick segments go on long enough to be uncomfortable?  Old Peter being passed out and pulled across Brooklyn with Miles along for the ride is funny for 30 seconds, can hold a good rhythm for a couple minutes, but the length it goes on in the movie starts to feel like they just wanted to make the poor guy suffer.

Alright!  Time to gush.
It’s not only a gorgeous movie, with an immediately recognizable New York with vibrant detail, but the crossover elements manifesting in the animation style both artistically and in motion sells effortlessly that these are people from incredibly different places.  Realizing Peter Porker so brilliantly in a cg animated film is something I’m not sure I can point to a better example of, Peni isn’t just out of an anime, she’s sporting that very slightly western style you’d see more in shows like Avatar than most anime out of Japan. The way Miles’ street art is brought to life does an amazing job of not just being impressive, but selling the way this is a manifestation of his self and spirit into physical form.

The little touches in the story and using the Spiders are nice.  I certainly plan to get this on video just so I can try and dissect some of the big scenes for added easter eggs.  The gags subtler gags worked in around the wackier characters hit home nicely: Spider-Noir vs Rubik’s Cube is something everyone should experience.  Spider-verse has my second favorite post-credits of the year (nothing’s going to top Ralph), definitely stick around for that.  And the movie being so willing to mix comedy and drama is always welcome; I’m never going to complain about a little girl mourning her robot companion while a talking pig offers her a shoulder.

In spite of all this madness the core of the story is always Miles’ Spider-Man origin, and that the madness around it only serves to support, emphasize, and contrast his twists on that origin.  Prowler’s design and unique lighting makes him absolutely pop against the other characters, lending him the most menace of any enemy in the film, which naturally lends that much more power to his refusal to hurt Miles in the end.  The shirt clutching speech, and its reversed reprise, is a perfect sort of grapple where you both feel how sudden and paralyzing it can be but also just as quickly remember it wouldn’t truly be hard to break out of for Spider-Man.  As noted several paragraphs ago, the similarity of Miles’ story to the others is a point of bonding; we’re the ones who’ve walked this road, and we know you too can come out the other side of it a hero.

It’s mostly visual, but I wanted to single out the final battle.  Because despite being probably the only big-name Marvel hero that he had no personal involvement in, I have to think that far more than Stan Lee or Steve Ditko, it’s Jack Kirby that gave this one a standing ovation from the beyond.  The way the super collider’s interdimensional portal manifest is possibly the first time I have ever seen Kirby’s art style so vividly, eye-poppingly rendered in motion.  Subatomic space in Ant Man and the magical realms of Dr. Strange have nothing on those perfect inky-black Kirby Dots from the beam between worlds.  The dimensional web we get glimpses of when someone’s passing through the door is so perfectly a recreation of expertly used negative space on a comic panel you can’t look away.  The way the rest of the room gets swallowed up by the energies and other dimensions spilling out of the portal, but you can see hints of the original room peaking behind them… ahh!!  So good!

There’s definitely some tendencies in the way the movie is written and presented that betray it’s younger target audience than most modern super hero fare, and the big emotional moments only rarely land with the same emotional punch as most of Pixar or Disney’s output, but the unique visual flair and openly inspirational messaging definitely elevate it into their company.  Not always for everyone, but something everyone needs a little more of in their life.

Rating- 8/10
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<NotMiki> I mean, we're talking life vs. liberty, with the pursuit of happiness providing color commentary.

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Re: CK's Cartoon Corner
« Reply #317 on: December 27, 2018, 08:38:00 PM »
Zombieland Saga (Season 1?)

This show went and did a thing, and it works hard to undue some of my goodwill toward it.
Don’t set up a redemption arc for your abusive asshole character unless you’re willing to really put in the work folks.

Zombieland Saga is a show that probably does require a bit of introduction, so let’s start with what it is.  There’s a subgenre of anime know as Idol Shows, that exist as a sort of cross-promotional effort to advertise and build up the backstory/mythos for an actual singing group.  Building into the real-life decline of the Idol business in Japan, or at least it’s diffusion and mutation into new forms, Zombieland Saga’s Franchouchou uses an extreme gimmick: each of the 6 performers in the group are dead, zombies raised by their manager to become the saviors of the Saga Prefecture, plagued by an aging populous and declining tourism.  And so each of them are legends within their field; the founder of a biker gang, a courtesan from the Meiji era, a Showa  era singer, the leader of a turn of the millennium Idol group who was struck by lightning and died mid-concert. 

And then there’s our lead character Sakura.  The show opens with her taking an acceptance letter for tryouts for an Idol group, practically leaping out her front door, declaring good morning to the world… and is promptly hit by a truck and killed.  Sakura is a well realized character who I like a lot but also the focal point for everything that keeps me from really embracing Zombieland Saga.  The intro here covers a lot of it: the show is completely unafraid to embrace the undead nature of its cast for extreme physical comedy and I can’t think of a single instance it worked for me.  And more importantly a lot of instances where the violence was just uncomfortable.  I dunno that I have anything eloquent to say here: I don’t like seeing girls decapitated for comedy.  Sorry.

More than that is Sakura’s role as the focal point of manager Kotaro’s behavior.  This guy is a fucking asshole, openly abusive of his charges, and Sakura is always front and center in most of his scenes.  His catchphrase may as well be “DUMBASS ZOMBIES”.  And here’s the thing.  Both overtly and covertly, Zombieland Saga faces the sheer grind and unseemly facts of the Idol life.  There’s an argument to be made the comedy is more meant to derive from the sort of “if you didn’t laugh you’d have to cry” nature of a lot of it, and creating a cast of heroines that can withstand it and rise above, turning the tragedies of their deaths into a source of strength as zombies, is sorta the point.  But you lose that thread pretty badly at a certain point.

Weakest Episode- It’s Zombiemental Saga.  This forms a bit of a two-parter with episode 6, and honestly it’s just kinda a dull episode unto itself.  But it’s the first signs of the “oh but actually the complete asshole really cared all along and just wanted to motivate you!!” aspect to Kotaro’s character, and ergggghhhhhhh.

No mistake, the final reveal is worse, but… when they hint that his motivation is directly tied to Sakura in episode 11 it’s also in context of Sakura finally pushing back against his abuse, deflecting some of the implications a bit, and in the (season?) finale when he turns out to have been a classmate of hers who hid his identity with a fake name after resurrecting her, it’s a two second flashback that’s not commented on and the rest of the episode is reasonably strong.  I guess the actual reveals of his background don’t really matter at this point, but the overall softening of his character without typically adjusting his behavior or showing a meaningful backlash, pushback, or comeuppance over it… it really kills the vibe on a show that mostly coasts on character beats and generating cast empathy.

Bad as all that is, it didn’t manage to completely kill my enthusiasm for the show, and what works her works too well.

Best Episode- Though My Life May Have Ended Once By Some Twist of Fate I have Risen, and If Song and Dance Are to Be My Fate, Then Carrying the Memories of My Comrades in My Heart As I Sally Forth Shall Be My Saga.
What the hell’s normal supposed to be?
There’s a subtlety to this one I dig a lot, and why I want to start talking about the good parts here.  Saki’s solution to the mess she finds her old life in is fascinating, because it amounts to recreating the circumstances of her death and that seems to have been the plan.  Her reaction to Reiko clocking her square in the jaw is to smile and tell young Maria ‘looks like your mom is plenty tough, maybe just prove to her you can keep up’.  While keeping her old gang alive was appealing, her main goal was always to make sure her best friend could keep that normal life she’d wanted, despite still not seeing the appeal.  And honestly I get the sense that, in part, she felt Reiko *deserved* to clock her one.  For dying in the first place, I imagine.
It’s also one of the funniest episodes for my money.  Girls armed with chainsaws step up to Saki for interfering.  Saki does a barest glance in their direction, the screen freezing into sketch art for an instant, and immediately they back down, knowing she’s far out of their league.  And if I have anything to say about it the Dorami Gang’s awkward stalk shall live forever.



There’s plenty of small moments between the cast of course.  Many belong to Saki (“Who cares what kinda junk she’s got!” indeed), but part of the main thrust of the season is the growing sense of camaraderie within Franchouchou and as such our lead character Sakura is often at the forefront.  Indeed, until earning Saki’s respect via rap battle in the second episode, Saki was pretty much content to just be a shiftless rebel in her undead life.  And to some extent a show that’s just small moments and girl bonding time is something I really appreciate right now, if I’m honest.

Rating- 6/10.  I watched this in shifts, and if I’d gone all the way up to Episode 12 without knowing the final reveal on Kotaro I’d probably have rated this a bit higher: being cued in that it was coming got me to notice the gradual shift towards more sympathetic characterization for him a lot more.  But yeah, that really sours what until then was more of an 8.  Blargh.
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<NotMiki> I mean, we're talking life vs. liberty, with the pursuit of happiness providing color commentary.

Captain K

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Re: CK's Cartoon Corner
« Reply #318 on: March 07, 2019, 05:59:40 AM »
CK, have you seen the Dragon Prince on Netflix?  It is super great.

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Re: CK's Cartoon Corner
« Reply #319 on: May 06, 2019, 11:08:53 PM »
Steven Universe (Season 2)

I think whoever did the episode selection is on the drugs, so this will be a bit looser than I usually do.  What they call season 2 here starts with "Say Uncle" and ends with "The Answer", and while the Season 1 set did rather obviously not stop at the actual end of the season so that's just a natural consequence, it is utterly baffling that they cut 4 episodes short of what most outlets call the end of Season 2 since uh... there's clearly an ongoing arc for Peridot they just... stop in the middle of.  It's really obvious that narratively "Message Received" is the actual end of the season from the barest glance at the summary!  Bah.

I mean if not for that aspect, sure, The Answer is a perfectly valid closure point to end a season on, but... they'd clearly gotten halfway through a distinct arc here, not just slow season-long buildup.

Now THAT said

Best Episode- Sworn to the Sword.  Goddammit Steven Universe you can stop making me characters already!  I'm already Pearl, you didn't have to make an entire episode about how Pearl feels she's less of a person and not worthwhile without serving another and teaching that behavior to the overly-smart and precocious budding sword girl!

All that said the season arc, despite the conclusion being chopped in half, is interesting because it feels a lot more like the show consciously trimmed down on the... filler for lack of better word to keep having more stuff with Peridot.  Granted the fact that Peridot is very... very blatantly a catgirl on the spectrum and they just take their sweet time shifting from "wait a minute" to "okay this is a little TOO obvious guys" makes it all kinda weird because she's honestly hilarious but I'm not sure how much I should actually laugh at it since some of it is clearly her having an extended breakdown, not just being quirky and high strung.

Honestly the biggest problem I have here actually is the episode collection because they stopped in a bad place so not having access to more of the show RIGHT NOW is a lot more annoying than it was with the Season 1 set.  Although the more compact season did give it more of a overall unified vibe which is cool.

Dunno about a rating honestly.
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Re: CK's Cartoon Corner
« Reply #320 on: May 06, 2019, 11:25:50 PM »
Seasons are an affectation for Steve Universe. Someone needed to market it for things.
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Re: CK's Cartoon Corner
« Reply #321 on: May 07, 2019, 12:11:25 AM »
You're not wrong (indeed I'm perfectly happy to be going to the series a few years later to avoid that hot mess), it's just weird that the writing has clear finales and stopping points but not only does the production not notice, but they didn't bother to correct it for the releases 5 years and a hundred plus episodes later.
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<NotMiki> I mean, we're talking life vs. liberty, with the pursuit of happiness providing color commentary.