Author Topic: Is there a politics thread? Guess I'm making one  (Read 46575 times)

Lady Door

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Re: Is there a politics thread? Guess I'm making one
« Reply #850 on: July 28, 2017, 10:18:53 PM »
POTUS:  Please abuse prisoners while making arrests.  Police: *thunderous applause* https://twitter.com/ShaunKing/status/891020515980267522

I have seriously checked out of following politics these days other than to comment on people's FB statuses and rant at sympathetic coworkers because it is just a neverending torrent of shit and I need to keep my belief that humanity generally has some redeeming qualities to it.

I want to do something useful but I honestly haven't got a clue what.
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Grefter

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Re: Is there a politics thread? Guess I'm making one
« Reply #851 on: July 28, 2017, 10:28:18 PM »
I am with Dunie (fuck you autocorrect) on this.   mcCain may be the tipping point, but he isn't the one pushing and pushing against it.  He should not be being praised as the hero of this story.  It is the people that made their stance consistent and known through the whole thing especially in the face of the party line (though normally
I am not going to be a fan of most of their policies).

McCain gets some points for doing the right thing for once in political power, but the people that championed against it the whole time are the heroes of this story.

Edit - holy fuck that clip.  For sure, just give peopleyou have detained and removed body autonomy from some head trauma.  That some one you have arrested but is not convicted of anything even pretending that corporal punishment was still a thing.

Holy shot I am going to go listen to some Fear Factory now because of just how much that statement says.


Edit - God fucking dammit duck you autocorrect.   Dunie is no asinine.
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Re: Is there a politics thread? Guess I'm making one
« Reply #852 on: July 28, 2017, 11:30:42 PM »
Also Reince Priebus was just fired and replaced with (Gen.) John Kelly, so we're one step closer to a crazypants military junta.

Happy weekend!
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Re: Is there a politics thread? Guess I'm making one
« Reply #853 on: July 29, 2017, 12:00:24 AM »
POTUS:  Please abuse prisoners while making arrests.  Police: *thunderous applause* https://twitter.com/ShaunKing/status/891020515980267522

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OblivionKnight

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Re: Is there a politics thread? Guess I'm making one
« Reply #854 on: July 29, 2017, 12:32:40 AM »
This is just a ridiculous amount of bullshit thrown out at once. I wonder if they're trying to put so much crap out at once that anything major is lost in the dust?

People keep attributing these moves to a conscious strategy.  That's what normal people pretending to be crazy would do.  These people are actually crazy, and the reason Trump does stuff like this is probably because he ate paint chips as a toddler and now he has no impulse control.  At this point, given the sprawling evidence we have before us, assigning a logical motive to Trump is nuts.  You only do it because your mind is trying to make sense of something that makes no sense.

Trump fired Comey, then bragged about it to the Russians because he genuinely thought firing Comey would ease the pressure on him.

Trump tweeted that he's banning transgender military service because the House GOP had an embarrassing squabble about whether the Pentagon should cover costs of gender reassignment surgery, and Trump thought, "no trans people, no problem!"

He thinks he's Alexander the Great and he sees Gordian knots everywhere he looks.
If he had any idea who Alexander the Great was or what the Gordian knot was, he'd think he was like that guy.  But he doesn't, obviously.

EDIT: Argh I did it too. fix'd.


I'm just trying to have some hope in humanity that our government is not a reality show trying to dig for ratings. 

Fuck me, can we have Chris Harrison as our President?  It would probably be better.
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dunie

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Re: Is there a politics thread? Guess I'm making one
« Reply #855 on: July 29, 2017, 12:26:59 PM »
Yeah, I am taking the mainstream (Not you OK) and their use as stepping across party lines as a shiity platform to stand on and I wouldn't doubt people using its multiple meanings. He was marginal vote, but it would have never got where it did or had the delays without Murkowski and Collins. Another way of me viewing this is like anything team-related, in which one player gets more attention over others. It also has those sexist contexts I don't need to sexplain.

Looks like the house passed a package that includes 1.5bil for a xenophobic fence also yesterday.

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Re: Is there a politics thread? Guess I'm making one
« Reply #856 on: August 02, 2017, 03:21:01 PM »
People keep attributing these moves to a conscious strategy.  That's what normal people pretending to be crazy would do.  These people are actually crazy, and the reason Trump does stuff like this is probably because he ate paint chips as a toddler and now he has no impulse control.  At this point, given the sprawling evidence we have before us, assigning a logical motive to Trump is nuts.  You only do it because your mind is trying to make sense of something that makes no sense.

Yeah, I've been following politics like a hawk because I'm terrified, but commenting on it very little, because commenting on it means trying to come up with explanations, and I don't know.  I can't explain these people.

Like...Trump's stupid military thing.  Or the Justice Deptartment redirecting civil rights division resources to take on discrimination against white people:

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/08/01/us/politics/trump-affirmative-action-universities.html?smprod=nytcore-iphone&smid=nytcore-iphone-share

Are they just extremely evil?  Are they just stupid and don't realize what they're doing?  Are they pretending to be evil for some kind of political purpose?  I don't know!


(At least with the health care vote I can actually understand that there is some level of political strategy.  When they've been campaigning for 7 years on repeal and replace Obamacare, even if their bill would be bad for the American people, and most of them seem to know it would be bad and unpopular--polls put it at 17% popularity--a bunch of them still thought that failing to pass the one piece of legislation they promised for 7 years would make them look even worse than passing a bad bill).

Luther Lansfeld

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Re: Is there a politics thread? Guess I'm making one
« Reply #857 on: August 02, 2017, 07:14:46 PM »
won't somebody please think of the white people  ::) ::) ::)
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NotMiki

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Re: Is there a politics thread? Guess I'm making one
« Reply #858 on: August 02, 2017, 10:48:00 PM »
Are they just extremely evil?  Are they just stupid and don't realize what they're doing?  Are they pretending to be evil for some kind of political purpose?  I don't know!

Mostly, they're evil.  Jeff Sessions?  Unquestionably evil.  He's doing what he's doing because he wants non-whites to suffer, wants them to be unable to participate as full-fledged members of American society.  An evil man through and through.  The only value his life serves is in providing a good example of the Lawful Evil archetype for DMs.

Most of the GOP senators are different - most of them don't have evil goals, because policy goals are largely irrelevant to them.  Personal advancement is their only true goal, and they're willing to condemn people to suffer and die needlessly in service of their ambition. (This personal ambition stuff is undoubtedly true of Democratic senators as well, but the Democratic platform is by and large good, not evil, so who cares?)
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Re: Is there a politics thread? Guess I'm making one
« Reply #859 on: August 03, 2017, 12:38:23 AM »
Yeah, I've been following politics like a hawk because I'm terrified, but commenting on it very little, because commenting on it means trying to come up with explanations, and I don't know.  I can't explain these people.

Like...Trump's stupid military thing.  Or the Justice Deptartment redirecting civil rights division resources to take on discrimination against white people:

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/08/01/us/politics/trump-affirmative-action-universities.html?smprod=nytcore-iphone&smid=nytcore-iphone-share

Are they just extremely evil?  Are they just stupid and don't realize what they're doing?  Are they pretending to be evil for some kind of political purpose?  I don't know!

My own theory is that this particular brand of evil is something the Trump administration is doing as a distraction. Don't forget, he's currently under investigation for collusion, and has also just failed at his attempt to repeal the ACA. These are things which piss off some of the people who voted for him, the one thing he can't afford politically. The solution? Distract everyone with some social justice stuff that his supporters largely agree with him on; the left starts complaining about that and Trump's base start to remember why they like him more than they like his political opponents.

Not that what he's doing isn't worth complaining about, mind! The whole situation is certainly rather frustrating, to pit it mildly.

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NotMiki

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Re: Is there a politics thread? Guess I'm making one
« Reply #860 on: August 03, 2017, 06:32:11 AM »
His record-low approval ratings seem to have been a reaction to the transgender military service ban, at least innsofar as we can read into the timing of it.  So that's something, at least.
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dunie

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Re: Is there a politics thread? Guess I'm making one
« Reply #861 on: August 18, 2017, 07:47:36 PM »
bye felicia

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Re: Is there a politics thread? Guess I'm making one
« Reply #862 on: August 18, 2017, 08:04:09 PM »
How many Nazis in the White House?  One less!

Still like... all of them, but one less!

That said, Bannon was the brains on the campaign trail, so if we can check Sessions and not get blown the fuck up, the uphill to get rid of the fucker is a lot less steep.
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OblivionKnight

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Re: Is there a politics thread? Guess I'm making one
« Reply #863 on: August 18, 2017, 09:01:26 PM »
Aha.

Ahahaha.

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Tide

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Re: Is there a politics thread? Guess I'm making one
« Reply #864 on: August 18, 2017, 09:32:32 PM »
Aha.

Ahahaha.

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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NotMiki

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Re: Is there a politics thread? Guess I'm making one
« Reply #865 on: August 20, 2017, 12:22:44 AM »
https://www.boston.com/news/local-news/2017/08/19/these-aerial-views-show-the-size-of-the-counter-protest-crowds-in-boston?event=event51

Went to the counterprotest today.  I'd say the tenor was a lot like the womens' march, except there were fewer kids, a lot more signs with the word 'fuck' on them, and waaaay more white people chanting "black lives matter" which sounds a lot less like favoritism when the issue of the day is "the President is a nazi sympathizer."  On the subway down to the meeting point for the march you could tell people were nervous, like are folks gonna show up to this thing, and is it going to be dangerous or violent?  Well, folks did show up.  40,000 folks, according to the city police commissioner (and I'd believe it) and the tenor of the day was blessedly peaceful and, despite everything, positive.  Took 3 hours to march 2 miles, and it was pretty draining, frankly.  The meager collection right-wing creeps called it a day early.
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Luther Lansfeld

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Re: Is there a politics thread? Guess I'm making one
« Reply #866 on: September 24, 2017, 06:25:55 PM »
http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/20788354/president-donald-trump-speaks-nfl-player-protests

Welp. Our President has decided to wage war on the NFL over peaceful protest during games. Cool.
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Re: Is there a politics thread? Guess I'm making one
« Reply #867 on: September 24, 2017, 10:18:15 PM »
I've been reading news like a hawk, but not actually posting much.  In a lot of cases there's just not much to analyze.  Like..."this is bad yep" "yep" "ok".

This Contra Points video actually gave me a fair bit to think about though:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QuN6GfUix7c

I'm not sure how realistic the advice of "be like Miles Davis" is, when people who want to see bad behaviour on the left will just cherry pick bad apples.  But it's interesting advice.

Grefter

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Re: Is there a politics thread? Guess I'm making one
« Reply #868 on: September 25, 2017, 03:54:51 PM »
Much like the video and the comments left after the post sort of alludes to, it is a bit of vapor-advice.  It is calling out the need/value in keeping on message, being understood and keeping the general public on your side, but it also lacks any of the impact or drive that the more fiery fronts on the left can drive. Edit - posting after midnight, missed key thing, it also in no way suggests how one acts like an ice cold motherfucker.

It is also interesting that there is a reference to the Tabby character not speaking to emotion and being too wrapped up in theory while also being criticized for Bash the Fash rhetoric which is pretty much 100% call to emotion.

Regardless though it is a really good video, very open and honest dialogue of things that she clearly struggles with while trying to be fair to external ideas.  Take all that and compress it into a fun skit? yeah this is some good Contrapoints.
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Re: Is there a politics thread? Guess I'm making one
« Reply #869 on: September 25, 2017, 05:06:15 PM »
Contra does have a way of building on her arguments as she goes (almost like her background is in formal logic and philosophy or something~) so hopefully future videos will revisit the ice cold motherfuckers thing.

I feel like the point is closer to "from the outside hard leftists look like they just want to fuck things up and make up gobbledegook to justify it after the fact", although those two things are presented in opposite order (that is, open with gobbledegook, then introduce Bash the Fash).  And if you're not already versed in either marxist or feminist theory well yeah, most leftist ideology does look that way.  By contrast fascism provides a clear emotional throughline from theory to action (moooostly because it's an A to B route because it is the most simpleminded of all philosophies) which makes it quicker, easier, more seductive.  Appeals to emotion that sound like reasoned arguments.  Then again, for 99% of them, they probably think they are making rational arguments.  Only takes a handful of manipulators to snowball a fascist movement.

Granted, I suppose the real point is just "you guys DO know this is also a PR war, right?", but without any clear answers on immediately applicable solutions.  It's telling the  skit ends on "well, don't get yourself killed" with no major vilification of Tabby.  Contrast both the TERF and Arguing with Fascists videos.
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dunie

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Re: Is there a politics thread? Guess I'm making one
« Reply #870 on: October 18, 2017, 05:03:56 PM »
[beware: stream of consciousness]

Re: #metoo

so this whole #metoo thing, I've been thinking a lot about the myriad responses coming from all different corners of the emotionalverse. And, because I'm trying to hold myself accountable to different communities beyond the dirty, soul-draining yet oddly comfortable ivory tower, I've joined the Women's March-turned-Alliance FB groups for Atlanta Georgia, and my district. And I comment rarely, unless there's just something gnawing at me. This lady posted a rebuttal to how #metoo is forcing women to bare their trauma, etc. And, that's a bit of a fucking overstatement. The author didn't convince me that the line between sharing and being forced is such a clear thing. But that said, the lady, who's shared that she also is holding onto years of sexual trauma said that "we've been saying this for years, people need to offer up some other thing." my first response in my head: "then perhaps you have enough experience to share ideas of your own? especially since you've have the time.." then I dial back, ya know, trying to be respectful and outside of my head I decided to frame my critique not towards her but this weird pattern of everyone criticizing any kind of digital protest.

like.

other than pessimism or ignorance, why would anyone assume that a digital protest is the extent of someone's actions of empowerment or dismantling [lib speak heterosexist misogynist patriarchal blah blah blah]?

Like. Really.

Why do we assume that when I put on a shirt with angela hillary etc. (yeah, commodification is another convo) that that's my only history as an active feminist?

there are fifty bagillion other situations in the world where people have provided tomes of information, studies, ideas, projects, actionable items that people sleep on or assume no one is using (and yes, it is very possible that people don't use it, like--- so called antiracist white liberals who can't read a book on their own, or black feminists who only cite chima to display their knowledge of so called third world feminism, or men who say they just don't know what to do about sexism can you please help me please). I am growing to distrust these think pieces even more because they're not really good at capturing the dissonance between the phenomena of internet protest and things people are doing in non-internet real life. like, yes, me too, almost every black woman (or .. someone else, I guess I'm being discriminatory here, I've never chatted with a nonblack woman who reads Ebony) who reads Ebony knows this phrase is old, yes, it's being attributed to white women (WHOSE SUHPRISED HURR?), but there are subtle differences being flattened out by just recognizing that me too was a phrase-turned-project and metoo is a hashtag that could inspire lazy antiracists to do things or can inspire longterm antiracists to rethink their strategies to fit with the current euphoria of internet feminism. i also question the integrity of men saying omg imma change now, and the big wall being built for sexual harassment to be a project that bills itself as open to harassment across the sexes.  i ain't all about OMGMETOO changed my life, but damn, it's always the people who do nothing but blow the hottest air who use writing to critique and get clicks or responses but they never put shit into action. if she was like "yo. this has been a thing for a while. we've already been saying it. if you're interested in engaging more deeply beyond a post, get at us." i feel like that basic ass thing would help a lot for the people who want to build socalledcoalitions. like. you don't gotta give everyone your syllabus. people learn better with effort. but damn, give someone an oreo and let them get the milk to wash it down.


NotMiki

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Re: Is there a politics thread? Guess I'm making one
« Reply #871 on: October 18, 2017, 05:41:55 PM »
A few of my own thoughts on Weinstein/me too.  Read an op-ed the thrust of which was "why do people indulge in this little feel-good exercise when it won't do anything."  Where do they find these morons?  Weinstein just got canned, people are up in arms over the manhattan DA, shit is happening.  Sure maybe nothing comes of it, so what?  You keep trying and trying and trying until something works.  (to quote Nier: Automata, even if it's pointless you still have to do it!)  And maybe you don't save the world in a single hashtag, but you save someone.  Jesus H. Christ these people.

On a related note, it's been pointed out that Weinstein was a promoter of womens' causes, and a Class A hypocrite.  To which I say: awesome.  I want everyone in the world to act as if assaulting women is unacceptable, even if they don't believe it.  Maybe the next generation will.
« Last Edit: October 18, 2017, 06:30:19 PM by NotMiki »
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Grefter

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Re: Is there a politics thread? Guess I'm making one
« Reply #872 on: October 19, 2017, 01:25:50 PM »
Good stuff

So... yeah awillingly own up to the fact that I need to get back into reading way more theory and am not as active as I should be... I am starting to get really frustrated (seeing some eye rolly stuff on social media from people I want better from) with some of the response as well.

Like, how fucking long have we been telling people and hearing about how you should listen and believe?  Then the moment you get people actually fucking opening up, even if it is just a simple Me Too it is the straight to the same bullshit "Virtue Signalling" and "Damn Millenials and their #hashtags. activism?  MORE LIKE SLACKTIVISM" kind of bullshit the right wing side of the internet discourse always bash on people with, but I am seeing it from some places that damn well should know better.  Even if you don't use the term Virtue Signalling and say it some other way, claiming people are doing it just to feel included or for attention is both a garbage argument and not fucking believing people on face value.

I also don't understand what avenue there is supposed to be for this kind of thing if not people sharing and discussing it on social media?  Like... yes you can get way more active than that, but fuck me man.  Should everyone organise like a big social event where we can have people be in public tell everyone that "hey you do know I have been sexually assaulted before right?"

The social media platforms allow you to have a much much broader social context and understanding of just how much it happens and people can do it in a soft way that keeps them feeling safe and comfortable since you are engaging with it on the level you want to which you have zero fucking option for in actual meatspace.
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Re: Is there a politics thread? Guess I'm making one
« Reply #873 on: October 22, 2017, 12:08:15 AM »
While going to check e-mail caught a news blurb about "North Korea threatens unimaginable nuclear strike on U.S."  I'll admit to feeling unsettled.

Rather than perpetuate cynicism, gloom, and pessimistic predictions on my end (as tempting as it is) I'll leave the following thought: I have this fantasy where the figurehead leaders of the U.S. and North Korea settle their differences in a mud wrestling pit.  I doubt this wish will be granted but no way am I letting the parade of dick wagging from certain world leaders dominate my mood.

dunie

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Re: Is there a politics thread? Guess I'm making one
« Reply #874 on: October 22, 2017, 10:34:19 AM »
Good stuff
better stuff

i imagine they'd prefer people to only write op eds and sign petitions that organizations are now looking at as less threatening. also, like, it's pretty clear they simply should readjust their understanding of the internet or figure out ways to engender what they want on it.i was listening to Still Processing's finale podcast episode "We Are Tired of Sexual Harassment" that ranted about #metoo and weinstein in general. queer-bee wesley morris pretty much admitted that, as a male and as a queer man in sausagefest situations where offenses do happen, he pretty much doesn't do anything except steer the direction in another way. and i think by that very fact of being honest and saying how he's failing the action he wants people to have has the potential to do a lot. i'm sure the impact will be exponentially greater were more queer id/het men to be more direct against such [trash]. women as well, although i can say for myself that i'm the exhausting one who rarely let's [trash] pass anymore. it's a great way for cathartic release, despite my meter filling on the daily.

*edited, wow, potty mouthdunie.
« Last Edit: October 22, 2017, 10:36:00 AM by dunie »