Author Topic: Dungeon Venture - Board Game Design Topic  (Read 1295 times)

Excal

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Dungeon Venture - Board Game Design Topic
« on: July 17, 2014, 09:28:42 PM »
This is the topic where I'll be posting stuff about a board game idea I have.  Specifically, it's meant to be a stock market game, except instead of trains and railroads, it's about building up Adventuring Guilds and sending them out on quests and trying to become filthy rich off the mortal peril of others.

That's right, you the player are not in any way, shape, or form an adventurer yourself.  Dear lord, that might involve some form of danger.  You're a patron, a go between for the Adventuer's Guilds and the various factions of the Kingdom, getting leads on adventurers and quests, and doling them out to the folks who'll get you the best return on your investments.  And, of course, you're also going to be the stockholders in these Guilds, giving them the start up capital they need in exchange for some influence in how they go about their business, and some nice appreciation on your initial outlay.  Or, perhaps just dumping their stock like the trash it is after you've gotten the use you need out of it (Shame about Ramsus' Elemental Questors, but trash is trash).

The game starts with everyone holding the same amount of gold, and when it all ends, the person with the most cash and the most valuable stocks is the winner.  As for how the game operates, it has five phases each round.

Order of Play:
   1. Stock Phase
   2. Acquisition Phase
   3. Assignment Phase
   4. Questing Phase
   5. Bookkeeping Phase

1. Stock Phase

   Players can purchase and sell stock at this time.
   Guilds need to have 5 of their 15 stocks purchased in order to become operational.
   An action consists of optionally selling shares, and then either buying a share or passing.
      Multiple shares can be sold at the same time.
         All shares are sold at their current price and then move down on the stock market a number of spaces equal to the number of shares sold.  If the marker hits the bottom of the chart, it stops moving.
      Only one share may be purchased at a time.
         The share is purchased at the value listed on the stock market.
         A player cannot buy stock in a guild they sold stock for earlier in that Stock Phase.
      As an action a player may pass.
   The Stock Phase ends when all players have passed consecutively.
   At the end of the Stock Phase, any Guild with all of its stock sold moves up one space on the Stock Market.  If it is already at the top, it does not move.


2. Acquisition Phase
   This is the period of the game where players interact with the five factions in the Kingdom, gaining influence, adventurers, and quests.
   The five factions are: The Crown, The Nobility, The Church, The Merchants, and The Academy.
   Each of these factions will have a influence metre as well as three piles of cards to draw from.
      The first deck is the Favour Deck.
         A player will gain influence for grabbing a card from the Favour Deck.
         Each card in the Favour Deck is a liability.
         Cards in the Favour Deck can never be discarded from a player's hand for any reason.  They must be played into a Guild.
      Decks two and three are the Standard Deck and the Privilege Deck.
         The Privilege Deck has better cards than the Standard Deck.  Both decks are beneficial.
         You must have the minimum amount of influence to draw from these decks, and then pay the appropriate price when drawing.
         These cards may be discarded at will after their purchase.  No refund will be given.
   There is a hand size limit of five cards.

   Actions will start with the start player and go to the left.
      There are three valid actions: Purchasing Influence, Taking a Card, and Passing.
         When purchasing influence, pick a faction and look at the value of the influence step one higher than where your marker presently is.
            Pay that amount, and then move your marker up one step.
         To draw a card, render payment for the card you wish to purchase, then draw the card.
            You may not draw a card if there is no room for it in your hand.
         A player may Pass.
           Once a player passes, they may take no other actions this Acquisition Phase.
           The first player to pass takes the start player token.
   Once each player has passed, the Acquisition Phase ends.

3. Assignment Phase
   This is when players bid to get the Guilds to accept their adventurers and Quests.
   Each Guild can accept two Adventurers and two Quests per turn.
   Starting from the start player, each player either places a card and a bid, or passes.
      Any bid must be placed in an empty slot, or must have a more valuable bid than the card currently in the slot.
         When placing the bid, you also need to place one of your sponsor markers to denote ownership.
         The value of a bid is the total of influence and gold placed on the card, and all stock owned in that Guild.
         When a card is outbid, it is returned to the its sponsor.
      Players may pass freely in place of bidding.
         Passing does not prevent further bidding.
   The Phase ends when all players have consecutively passed.
   When the Phase ends, all hired adventurers move from the bidding slots to the Guild roster.
      If there is no room on the Guild Roster, the highest numbered Adventurer is Laid-Off.
         If there is still not enough room, repeat this process until there is enough room.

4. Quest Phase
   Each Guild will, in order, go on the quests they were given in the Assignment Phase.
   In numerical order, from lowest to highest, the quests will resolve.
      The Quest with the highest influence bid will resolve first, followed by the other Quest.
         If there is a tie in influence, Quests resolve from left to right.
         Adventurers can only be assigned to one quest.
         Adventurers will be assigned to Quests in the following method.
            First, check the negative numbered Adventurers.
               Assign the highest numbered negative Adventurer with a relevant trait.
            Second, go through the positive Adventurers from lowest to highest.
               When an Adventurer has a relevant trait, assign it to the Quest.
                  Continue this until either...
                     All of the requirements of the quest have been met, which constitutes a Pass.
                     Or, all of the Adventurers have been gone through, which constitutes a Fail.
         In the case of a Pass the following occurs:
            Stock Holders get reward gold for each share they possess.
            Guild Stock appreciates on Market Chart according to reward marker.
            Influence is given to the players who 'own' the Quest and the Adventurers who went on it.
            As well, some quests will cause Retirement or Flight, both of which remove Adventurers.
         In the case of a Fail the following occurs:
            Guild Stock will depreciates one space left, with possible extras depending on the Quest.
            Some Quests will cause Laid-Off or Flight Status upon failure.
            Additionally, all positive numbered Adventurers feel bad for failing.
               Negative numbered Adventurers are incapable of feeling shame.
      When all Guilds are done Questing the phase ends.

5. Bookkeeping Phase
   This Phase is simply checking to see if the game end conditions have been met.
   If three of the draw piles are empty, then the game ends.

Departure of an Adventurer
   When one of these in caused by a Quest Result, only Adventurers on the Quest are considered.
      Only positive numbered Adventurers are considered for these three effects.
   There are three ways for an Adventurer to leave a Guild: Retirement, Laid Off, and Flight.
      Flight is the worst way for an Adventurer to Leave, and represents the powers that be hunting them.
         Usually only the result of a Quest Failure.
         Can also result from Favour Quest success.
            On a favour success, this will effect the highest numbered Adventurer.
            On a failure (any kind), this will effect the lowest number Adventurer.
      Laid Off is the neutral way for an Adventurer to leave a Guild.
         Usually the result of too many Adventurers being hired.
         The Sponsor gains a Guild Influence when an Adventurer is Laid Off.
         If it's the result of a Quest result, then the highest number Adventurer is Laid Off.
      Retirement is the best way for an Adventurer to leave, indicating they made it rich.
         Almost always Retirement is caused by success.
         The lowest numbered Adventurer retires.
         Upon retirement, the following happens:
            The Guild moves left one space on the Market Chart.
            The Sponsor gains Guild Influence.
            The Sponsor gains Faction Influence from the Faction the Adventurer came from.
            The Sponsor gains gold equal to a share reward from the quest that caused retirement.
   Negative Adventurers have their own special Retirement Rule.
      They can Retire regardless of whether or not there is a Retirement Reward.
      They can only Retire if there are three negative Adventurers (including them) in their Guild.
         If that is true, then participating in a successful Quest will automatically retire the negative Adventurer.
      The Sponsor gets nothing from this retirement.


End Game Scoring
   When the game ends, each play adds up the gold they have and the market value of all of their stock.
   Richest person wins.
      If there is a tie, most value of Influence wins.
         If there is still a tie, most Royal Influence, followed by most Tier 2 Influence, followed by Most Tier 1 Influence.
            If there is still a tie, most sponsored Adventurers active at endgame wins.
               If there is still a tie, then the game is tied.  Congratulations to all involved.

Excal

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Re: Dungeon Venture - Board Game Design Topic
« Reply #1 on: July 17, 2014, 09:29:34 PM »
Notes on Adventurers

Alright, I'm planning for four different class of Adventurers.  Each class has four skills they are good at (or in the case of the 'special' adventurers, are bad at).  This is a first draft of the out lay for them, as there's a few skills I'm not quite sure about just yet.  After that, there'll be a starter list of Personal Qualities which aren't class specific.  The way those go negative is a red box instead of a blue one, and they can cancel  out a blue box, or go negative if it matters.  Regardless, the list is incomplete, so if people want to brainstorm stuff, I'd be happy to take suggestions.

Another thing, not quite related to this, that I'd be wanting to take suggestions and brainstorming on?
Quests and general Adventurer Outlines.  Heck, I'll stick a few example adventurers on the bottom.

Fighters
   Weapon Skill
   Brawn
   Endurance
   Inspiration

Mages
   Combat Magic
   Thaumaturgy
   Detecting Magic
   Lore

Thieves
   Sneaking
   Quick Talking
   Lock Picking
   Thievery

Clerics
   Healing
   Divination
   Composure
   Rituals

Personal Qualities
   Charismatic
   Attractive
   Mighty
   Resourceful
   Fae Blood



Example Adventurers:

Rachelle (Priest)
   Healing - 2
   Divination - 0
   Composure - 4
   Rituals - 1
      Economist
Having faithfully served the Church of Erathis for many years, Rachelle has achieved the rank of Bishop in their ranks.  Less for the rare healing arts she's mastered in her travels, nor even her skill in mercantilism that the Church values, but because she's possessed of an exceptionally level head no matter how absurd the situation she finds herself in.


Desmond (Fighter)
   Weapon Skill - 1
   Brawn - 0
   Endurance - 3
   Inspiration - 3
      Sex Appeal (Red)
Some people think you need a strong offense to make your way in the world.  Desmond is the living counter to these people.  Quitting simply isn't a word he has much use for, and he simply keeps on trying until he accomplishes whatever it is he set out to do, and brings the people he's with along with him.  Of course, what makes him famous on the battlefield makes him infamous in the taverns.  Who knew women don't like a guy who doesn't know how to quit.


Marza (Mage)
   Combat Magic - 5
   Thaumateurgy - 1
   Detecting Magic - 1
   Lore - 1
      Charismatic (Red)
      Reputable (Red)
      Trustworthy (Red)
The Crimson Devil is one of the strongest combat mages the world has ever seen.  If only the Devil title was less literal.


Feth (Thief)
   Sneaking - 4
   Quick Talking - 3
   Lock Picking - 0
   Thievery - 1
No one is entirely sure what Feth is.  What is certain is that Feth is excellent at not being seen when s/he doesn't want to be seen, and surprisingly adept at talking when it does.


And, an example of a Favour.  Mild apologies, though it is running off of a bit of an in game joke.  Also, a mild bad Adventurer.

Kieva (Mage)
   Combat Magic - -1
   Thaumateurgy - -3
   Detecting Magic - 2
   Lore - 0
      Commanding
None are more eager to join a quest than Kieva.  Which makes it odd that, despite what she assures us are her best efforts, it's the folks she's questing against that usually end up being the beneficiaries of her magic.
« Last Edit: July 17, 2014, 11:53:02 PM by Excal »

Excal

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Re: Dungeon Venture - Board Game Design Topic
« Reply #2 on: July 17, 2014, 11:58:01 PM »
Finally, why am I posting all this here.

Simple, part of it is to use it as a sort of motivation.  It's in a public place, so let's get it done.

The other part is I'm pretty open to people who want to comment on it.  See something that isn't clear and you want to ask about, please do!  Way too much stuff is probably still just inferred in my head space and needs to be spelled out.  Think you can see a better way to do a mechanic?  Want to toss out ideas for Adventurers, Quests, or Characteristics?  I'd be happy to see 'em.

So, yeah.  This is it for the start.  Next update should include starter quests.  And possibly even some rough work on what a board would look like.

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Re: Dungeon Venture - Board Game Design Topic
« Reply #3 on: July 18, 2014, 12:09:44 AM »
Hey cool idea!

It seems like something that'd be fun to play at a DLCon :)

Admittedly I'm not quite sure how the whole thing would play out quite yet, but it looks interesting. I'm not quite the board game aficionado that Andy and the others are, so I'm less capable of immediately reading the rules and then understanding how the game's intricacies would work in actual play without seeing it in action first. Would love to see what a sample board might look like!

I don't know the in-joke, but I chuckled at Kieva.

AndrewRogue

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Re: Dungeon Venture - Board Game Design Topic
« Reply #4 on: July 18, 2014, 05:56:24 AM »
This'll be a work in progress style response. Everything I say is just based on spur or the moment/random thoughts, so don't consider it gospel or must change stuff. I'll continue posting as I have more thoughts. Bold text is my thoughts.

The game starts with everyone holding the same amount of gold, and when it all ends, the person with the most cash and the most valuable stocks is the winner.  As for how the game operates, it has five phases each round.

I'm working off assumptions here, but I'd guess that guilds start with some number of adventurers and stuff? As presented, the game starts off in a totally neutral state, which is a bit dull and makes early choices somewhat weak. It might be worth considering starting the various guilds (and their stock) in random positions.

Order of Play:
   1. Stock Phase
   2. Acquisition Phase
   3. Assignment Phase
   4. Questing Phase
   5. Bookkeeping Phase

1. Stock Phase

   Players can purchase and sell stock at this time.
   Guilds need to have 5 of their 15 stocks purchased in order to become operational.

Gonna need to be careful here. This sounds like it makes the game start very, very slowly, especially pending player counts.

   An action consists of optionally selling shares, and then either buying a share or passing.
      Multiple shares can be sold at the same time.
         All shares are sold at their current price and then move down on the stock market a number of spaces equal to the number of shares sold.  If the marker hits the bottom of the chart, it stops moving.
      Only one share may be purchased at a time.

This makes coattail riding really, really easy.

         The share is purchased at the value listed on the stock market.
         A player cannot buy stock in a guild they sold stock for earlier in that Stock Phase.
      As an action a player may pass.
   The Stock Phase ends when all players have passed consecutively.
   At the end of the Stock Phase, any Guild with all of its stock sold moves up one space on the Stock Market.  If it is already at the top, it does not move.

I saw it increases at the bottom, but it really feels like guild stock decreases WAY faster than it increases. This seems to make some very nasty blowouts possible due to turn order, where you can reasonably tank a guild's value before another player has the chance to sell.

2. Acquisition Phase
   This is the period of the game where players interact with the five factions in the Kingdom, gaining influence, adventurers, and quests.
   The five factions are: The Crown, The Nobility, The Church, The Merchants, and The Academy.
   Each of these factions will have a influence metre as well as three piles of cards to draw from.
      The first deck is the Favour Deck.
         A player will gain influence for grabbing a card from the Favour Deck.
         Each card in the Favour Deck is a liability.
         Cards in the Favour Deck can never be discarded from a player's hand for any reason.  They must be played into a Guild.
      Decks two and three are the Standard Deck and the Privilege Deck.
         The Privilege Deck has better cards than the Standard Deck.  Both decks are beneficial.
         You must have the minimum amount of influence to draw from these decks, and then pay the appropriate price when drawing.
         These cards may be discarded at will after their purchase.  No refund will be given.
   There is a hand size limit of five cards.

   Actions will start with the start player and go to the left.
      There are three valid actions: Purchasing Influence, Taking a Card, and Passing.
         When purchasing influence, pick a faction and look at the value of the influence step one higher than where your marker presently is.
            Pay that amount, and then move your marker up one step.
         To draw a card, render payment for the card you wish to purchase, then draw the card.
            You may not draw a card if there is no room for it in your hand.
         A player may Pass.
           Once a player passes, they may take no other actions this Acquisition Phase.
           The first player to pass takes the start player token.

First player is really strong due to the Stock Phase. Like, devastatingly strong.

   Once each player has passed, the Acquisition Phase ends.

It occurs to me that, with bad luck, it seems possible to go effectively bankrupt in this game. Needing to buy everything is kind of a problem. Favors seem very disadvantageous, since you have to lock up a hand space and still pay (via auctions) to actually use them. It feels circumstantially like the rich can get way richer and the poor can get way poorer in this game.

3. Assignment Phase
   This is when players bid to get the Guilds to accept their adventurers and Quests.
   Each Guild can accept two Adventurers and two Quests per turn.

This might actually making bidding too non-competitive. Two slots for each means you need a total of three cards really wanting to be placed. It probably also means the first slot is low competition unless someone really wants to place two cards of one type.

   Starting from the start player, each player either places a card and a bid, or passes.
      Any bid must be placed in an empty slot, or must have a more valuable bid than the card currently in the slot.
         When placing the bid, you also need to place one of your sponsor markers to denote ownership.
         The value of a bid is the total of influence and gold placed on the card, and all stock owned in that Guild.
         When a card is outbid, it is returned to the its sponsor.
      Players may pass freely in place of bidding.
         Passing does not prevent further bidding.
   The Phase ends when all players have consecutively passed.
   When the Phase ends, all hired adventurers move from the bidding slots to the Guild roster.
      If there is no room on the Guild Roster, the highest numbered Adventurer is Laid-Off.

Crippling guilds seems surprisingly easy. If someone has a good adventurer at a full guild, you bid absolute minimum and guarantee their removal. Similarly, bad adventurers are surprisingly hard to remove.

         If there is still not enough room, repeat this process until there is enough room.

You mentioned this in chat, but this phase may last way too long due to the number of auctions. Bid slots may be a wise choice here, since they streamline the process a bit and force players to take risks based on what players MAY do.

4. Quest Phase
   Each Guild will, in order, go on the quests they were given in the Assignment Phase.
   In numerical order, from lowest to highest, the quests will resolve.

This has some crippling blowout potential due to the way adventurers are assigned.

      The Quest with the highest influence bid will resolve first, followed by the other Quest.
         If there is a tie in influence, Quests resolve from left to right.
         Adventurers can only be assigned to one quest.
         Adventurers will be assigned to Quests in the following method.
            First, check the negative numbered Adventurers.
               Assign the highest numbered negative Adventurer with a relevant trait.
            Second, go through the positive Adventurers from lowest to highest.
               When an Adventurer has a relevant trait, assign it to the Quest.
                  Continue this until either...
                     All of the requirements of the quest have been met, which constitutes a Pass.
                     Or, all of the Adventurers have been gone through, which constitutes a Fail.
         In the case of a Pass the following occurs:
            Stock Holders get reward gold for each share they possess.
            Guild Stock appreciates on Market Chart according to reward marker.
            Influence is given to the players who 'own' the Quest and the Adventurers who went on it.
            As well, some quests will cause Retirement or Flight, both of which remove Adventurers.
         In the case of a Fail the following occurs:
            Guild Stock will depreciates one space left, with possible extras depending on the Quest.
            Some Quests will cause Laid-Off or Flight Status upon failure.
            Additionally, all positive numbered Adventurers feel bad for failing.
               Negative numbered Adventurers are incapable of feeling shame.
      When all Guilds are done Questing the phase ends.

This seems really, really fiddly. I'd need to see it in more detail though.

5. Bookkeeping Phase
   This Phase is simply checking to see if the game end conditions have been met.
   If three of the draw piles are empty, then the game ends.

Departure of an Adventurer
   When one of these in caused by a Quest Result, only Adventurers on the Quest are considered.
      Only positive numbered Adventurers are considered for these three effects.
   There are three ways for an Adventurer to leave a Guild: Retirement, Laid Off, and Flight.
      Flight is the worst way for an Adventurer to Leave, and represents the powers that be hunting them.
         Usually only the result of a Quest Failure.
         Can also result from Favour Quest success.
            On a favour success, this will effect the highest numbered Adventurer.
            On a failure (any kind), this will effect the lowest number Adventurer.
      Laid Off is the neutral way for an Adventurer to leave a Guild.
         Usually the result of too many Adventurers being hired.
         The Sponsor gains a Guild Influence when an Adventurer is Laid Off.
         If it's the result of a Quest result, then the highest number Adventurer is Laid Off.
      Retirement is the best way for an Adventurer to leave, indicating they made it rich.
         Almost always Retirement is caused by success.
         The lowest numbered Adventurer retires.
         Upon retirement, the following happens:
            The Guild moves left one space on the Market Chart.
            The Sponsor gains Guild Influence.
            The Sponsor gains Faction Influence from the Faction the Adventurer came from.
            The Sponsor gains gold equal to a share reward from the quest that caused retirement.
   Negative Adventurers have their own special Retirement Rule.
      They can Retire regardless of whether or not there is a Retirement Reward.
      They can only Retire if there are three negative Adventurers (including them) in their Guild.
         If that is true, then participating in a successful Quest will automatically retire the negative Adventurer.
      The Sponsor gets nothing from this retirement.


End Game Scoring
   When the game ends, each play adds up the gold they have and the market value of all of their stock.
   Richest person wins.
      If there is a tie, most value of Influence wins.
         If there is still a tie, most Royal Influence, followed by most Tier 2 Influence, followed by Most Tier 1 Influence.
            If there is still a tie, most sponsored Adventurers active at endgame wins.
               If there is still a tie, then the game is tied.  Congratulations to all involved.